NYCC ‘25 INTERVIEW-A-THON: Todd McFarlane

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Hey everybody, this is the creator of Spawn, co-creator of Venom.

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um And I'm telling you, Bar Pod, it's the coolest place on the internet right now.

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Welcome to the Oblivion Bar podcast with your host, Chris Hacker and Aaron Norris.

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Joining us today is the president and co-founder of Image Comics.

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Along with being an iconic figure within the world of comic books, he is also a giant in the world of toys and collectibles with McFarland Toys.

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It is my great honor to welcome the Todd father himself, Tom McFarland onto the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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Hey Chris, Aaron.

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Hey, before we get going, I'm gonna give you a little uh marketing tip here.

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You guys could have just taken both your last names, cut a few letters at the end of both of them and your show could have been called Hack No.

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So, Aaron, it in the chest.

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We're talking to a marketing guru here.

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So I'm telling you, we need at least keep it on the deck.

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Hashtag spin off.

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Yeah.

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No, no, it's a good one.

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Come on.

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Man, I'm staring you guys in the face.

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uh It kind of sounds like an automata Pia, like in a comic hack.

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No, like someone gets hit in face.

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Heck no.

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Todd, you know, we talked a little bit before the actual recording here and we'll just reiterate it.

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We'll probably say it a couple more times.

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We apologize for the fanboying, but my gosh, what a pleasure it is to get you here on the show today and to talk about not, know, not only your career, but I think maybe the central pillar is talking about spawn 50 or King spawns 50.

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Excuse me.

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Before we get to King spawn 50, I want to bring up something that I stumbled upon while researching for this conversation that I'm not sure a ton of people know.

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And it's that you've worked on a ton of really awesome music videos like.

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Well, wouldn't say a ton, but a handful, yeah.

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I mean enough to where it's like a cornucopia of really cool bands and great music videos as well.

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Pearl Jam, Korn, Disturbed, The Prince of Darktest himself Ozzy Osbourne, may he rest in peace, recently unfortunately passed back at the end of July.

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my first question for you Todd is, you've worn it seems like every hat imaginable, writer, artist, entrepreneur, businessman, director and so on.

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I would say the one constant threat your entire career I feel is that you are fighting for that freedom and creative control.

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So my question for you is, do you feel that need for that creative control still today in 2025?

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The simple answer is yes, but I've also gotten older and wiser to understand that there are different dynamics that at times that's not feasible or it's not prudent or generous.

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if I was doing a project with you two and you guys came with the idea and...

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and And I put in half the money and you put in half the money.

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I shouldn't be sitting there going, Hey, I want to, I want to create a freedom.

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want to be able to dictate this.

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Right.

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So it depends on the circumstances.

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Um, if it's something that I think that I'm the lead on.

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I'm bringing, you know, the sort of the majority of the value, then I think I can sort of puff out my chest and do it.

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But if you're playing within the confines of a group of people on a team and you're, you need to be a good partner.

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So.

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Each one's sort of an individual assessment, if you will.

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But do I still have the need to be able to spread my wings and put my creative ideas as close to what I have in my head as possible?

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Yeah, I'm always pushing that one.

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Which is why I have my comic books, because those are lock, stock, and barrel, 100 % mine.

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And I don't have to get any approvals from anybody on the outside to do those.

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Well, we've heard you talk about this ethos of not striving for perfection as a creator, but instead just wanting to capture a reader two to three times in an issue.

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And I've heard you call it searching for the moment in other interviews.

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What moments can you think of from throughout your career that after getting them on the page, you knew that that was really going to resonate with the readers?

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You know, in all honesty, I don't really.

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sort of do a deep dive into my own work.

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This is always interesting when you do, you analyze yourself, right?

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And you're just basically living your life.

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What I do say though is that there should be a couple of visual takeaways from any sort of comic book you do so that those couple moments or dialogue or scene or whatever that basically and will resonate so that you will remember it even though you don't remember all of Look it, we could do this with movies and TV shows, but let's take movies.

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We can recite lines and or scenes from a movie, but we don't know the lines and or all the scenes in the movie.

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But we like that movie, why?

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Because we remember four or five parts in it that we just go, yeah.

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And so I think that comic books should have the same impact.

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But we've only got 20 for the most part 20 pages.

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So Can you hit them once or twice?

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Get people to remember it.

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Like I said, I don't remember every page of Dark Knight But I do have vivid recollection of some visuals that I could close my eyes and draw right now That's a value the other piece of it that might have got lost in that is that not chasing the elusive perfection Allows you to get your work done and you're not torturing yourself and you're not sitting there lamenting over it because we're in a, for the most part, a deadline driven business.

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I, that's the point what matters then at that point is the volume of work that you do.

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We all have favorites.

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We all have favorite actors, musicians, artists, comic book people.

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We can't honestly say that everything they've done was super awesome.

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We like what they did.

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So the courtesy and maybe we think that they basically weren't at the top of their game.

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That's okay.

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And that's the victory from the creative person that you can then have an off day and the fan base will still be loyal because they're not judging you on today.

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They're judging you now on the scope of your career, right?

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Like look at Shohei Otani, biggest baseball player.

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in baseball, you're a Shohei Ohtani, Osaanjers Dodgers fan, if he goes 0 for 4 and strikes out three times, are you getting off the bandwagon?

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Of course not, of course not.

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Because you're going, ah, he had a bad day, but you should have hit him yesterday.

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Being an artist and a creator is the same way.

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more bats you stay in with baseball, the more at bats you have, the more credit they'll give you for your career stats instead of the single day stats.

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Yeah, isn't it the saying is like perfection is the enemy of progress?

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I'm the Come on.

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Look, I always keep saying, I do it.

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It's the elusive perfection, but I'm never gonna grab it.

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I know that I'm never gonna grab it.

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And then I'm gonna die.

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So two things are going to happen, which is why we're all creative people are neurotic.

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Is it one, we're never going to actually ever perfect piece.

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And we know that going to our great and who the one that's bending.

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Yeah.

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grave with our best ideas still here, right?

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That we never, just go for it, but because we're just constantly, we're sort of an odd things are always just squirreling around in our head and we, know we're never going to be able to unleash it all.

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got to argue one thing that you said is like, there's so, you know, there's some movies that we just never know the, the words and all the scenes I've got to, for some reason, like that's my, my sad superpower.

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But I'll say this, there's one niche that I absolutely love and that's Chris can tell you my love that I, that I collect is movie comic adaptations.

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And one of the first ones I ever got was the, the spawn movie comic, you know, adaptation.

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And because I love, like I can, I can quote that movie till the day that I die.

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He's doing the violator cheerleader dance before you popped on camera tonight.

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uh I just got to say that, but you did strike me with another question or another, you know, motivation for a question.

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And that was, um, not necessarily speaking about perfection, but are there any other creators working today that you feel perfectly like capture the moment in a similar way, you know, that we, we'd heard that you did, but like, are there any that do it now that way that capture the moment?

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We're all trying to capture the moment, right?

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I mean, again, I'm not, I'm not saying that we, we are.

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But what you have to do is not lament if you don't, right?

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oh And it's not answering your question directly, but I've had some odd conversations with some of my peers.

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uh A category, to lament the moment.

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And it's like, dude, there's nothing you can do today that is gonna get your fan base to dislike you like today.

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You could draw a stick figure and they're gonna go, ah, wasn't his best.

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But you know what, those other 3,000 covers he did or whatever.

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So he saw he had an off day.

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At a certain point, you're sort of on having a bad day.

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what would you recommend?

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is then don't worry about it.

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your craft at that point.

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And some days it's going to be better than others.

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it's already once you you especially with a fan base and a loyalty, there should come some freedom with that.

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And enjoyment with it.

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Where I see with a lot of my peers that that it's a them.

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It's going, man, I can't disappoint them and I can't let them down and I can't and I can't and it's like as long as you're doing, they're never going to be grudging.

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You've given them 20 years.

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Like you've got them, you've got them and so you're wasting a lot of energy.

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that could otherwise just be relaxed and rechanneled.

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Really cool creative stuff.

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So, you're good! To me.

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that it's like they don't know their own standing or whatever else, but also.

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say that the one great lesson that I've learned from my 20th birthday, almost 40 years later, personalities come into play, all equations of every conversation you're about to have.

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I used to think when I was that there was a blueprint, I could just take a blueprint, give it to the person next to me.

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If they followed the blueprint, they would get the same result.

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I now know that's not true.

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that personality, not only a giant piece in it, it may be the majority piece in it, right?

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That if you don't have the personality to go along with what it is that you're trying to accomplish, it doesn't matter.

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I mean, it's the proverbial taking the horse to the water, shoving the horse's head in the water, and they still won't drink.

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That's just a personality, right?

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It doesn't mean it's bad.

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It just means it's a personality.

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factor that in way, way, way more.

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So do I see people lamenting and m all those things?

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Yes, but I see at times an obsessive, almost negative way that it's come on.

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You could have just moved another page of your creation.

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You know, it's funny.

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I have a two part response to what you just said there.

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Number one, when we talked to Brian K.

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Vaughn last year about the return to saga at Image Comics, funny enough, he mentioned basically exactly, he sort of echoed exactly what you're saying, which it was a two-parter.

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Basically it was that A, you can't think about the reader.

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When you're writing or drawing or creating, you have to do this stuff for you and your creative team, your creative venture.

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If you think about the reader at any point, you've lost the thread, right?

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And then the second part to what you had mentioned there with the sort of lamenting on a particular page or story or a project or anything.

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We had Patrick Reynolds on the show early last year, who was the artist on Gunslinger Spawn with Jimmy Pamiati not too long ago.

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yeah, and he is, think, one of our undiscovered geniuses in comics.

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say undiscovered genius, not because I don't think not enough people know about him, but because he puts out not enough work.

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And it's because in something that he has said himself is that he sort of, he obsesses, as you put it, he laments on this process and the product's incredible.

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What ends up happening at the end is insane.

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But uh like you said, the perfectionism in it all could be a deterrent at certain points.

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Because if you're going to, let me just say that again, you know, as you get older, you sort of get a little bit of sort of hindsight.

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The hindsight is if you're going to sort of do a little bit of work, then yes, you need to strive for that to all be magical, or as much of it is magical as possible.

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If you think you have the will to do a large body of work, then at some point then this is the freedom.

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you don't have to assess about it.

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So I guess it depends on what you think you're going to be doing overall, right?

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And so Patrick is probably there because to your point, he hasn't put out as much work as other vets and he's not as well known.

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So it matters more to him, he thinks, that like this page could be the thing that takes me to the next level, the next rung up, right?

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And when I was younger, I went through all those machinations.

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So I completely get it ah of what they're doing.

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Like I said, to me, the younger creators, I get it.

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I did it.

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It's the 20-year vats that are already there that are at the top.

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They're still doing it.

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But like I said, that becomes uh a personality quirk.

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And again, I'm not saying it's good or bad.

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I'm just saying it's right.

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to Kay Vaughn's point, I don't think he's saying you disregard the audience.

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You don't care about the audience.

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I think probably he's closer where I am, which is do what you think is right, given skills and and the that you have right now creatively.

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Whether people know it or not, is that you don't have to give us your comments because we get it.

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The sales report and so sales are going up steady.

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Know that the group we have are liking and if the sales go in half.

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The people who were supporting us have fallen off the boat.

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And so then.

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do some reflection one way or the other going, Hey, how can I turn it around?

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Or if it's going up, then how can I keep doing that or feed more of it?

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So we're that without having to really have any real big, meaningful interaction.

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the piece too.

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And this is where I run into it with some light here is that if you all the, you can't self serve at all.

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You can't do it right.

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Simple level.

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It's like when I do.

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you know, basketball toys or whatever.

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There's a fan.

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for every single team, right?

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But at some point...

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I can't do every favorite player for every team.

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have to pick players.

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I think our national level, that's who I have to pick.

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So I'm not saying your guy isn't good.

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I'm not saying good saying people would rather buy players on the New York Yankees and they would the Florida Marlins.

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That's all I'm saying.

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Like it's just a data driven thing.

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So.

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It's a market difference, right?

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Like uh the New York market is far bigger than I would say probably the Miami, I would say Miami, but it's the Florida Marlins market in terms of that.

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So I want to move on to uh actually the main reason why you're here today, Todd, which is we're going to have a little, Aaron, what do we call it?

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We call it a spawn talk.

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Spawn talk.

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Kids love chains, right?

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Yeah.

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So Todd, you've often talked about how you would like to see more creator own books continue on and adopt a more ongoing approach and strive to hit that landmark 50th issue, right?

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And that's something that you're about to do here with King's Spawn number 50.

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And I wanted to have you sort of talk about and sort of noodle on this idea of this new program that you and the image team have put together of like, I'm calling it and Aaron and are calling it the triple 50 program.

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I don't know that's what it's actually being called, but.

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I just call it 50-50-50.

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Most people go, hey, you got a 50-50 chance.

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I'm just adding another 50 to it.

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And again, So by 250 you get 150 for free.

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Yeah, to jump in because we're going to be at Gunslinger 50 and Scorch 50, right?

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The three books that I launched in 2021 are all going to be hitting, not surprisingly, 50 months later, their 50th issue, right?

00:19:35.689 --> 00:19:40.980
So, and I staggered those books every other month, so they're going to roll out and that's it.

00:19:40.980 --> 00:19:47.301
I'm going to have in a short order, three more books that have hit issue 50.

00:19:47.470 --> 00:19:50.710
Now, can you talk a little bit about sort of the incentive of this whole program?

00:19:50.710 --> 00:20:00.597
Because there was a news release that came out a couple of weeks ago talking about how this one in 1,000 is going to be an insane get if you're able to get your hands on one of these.

00:20:00.597 --> 00:20:02.763
Yeah, it's weird to me because...

00:20:02.763 --> 00:20:13.433
I've always been resistant to some of what I'm to get some small shop to buy 400, 500.

00:20:13.433 --> 00:20:15.761
uh Thousand, that's stupid, right?

00:20:15.761 --> 00:20:16.714
Like, what do you think?

00:20:16.714 --> 00:20:19.858
I just go, no, I'm not gonna do it.

00:20:20.362 --> 00:20:22.740
eventually, know, I'm gonna.

00:20:22.740 --> 00:20:24.342
We gotta give them something though.

00:20:24.342 --> 00:20:34.378
oh We gotta give them something worthy of And the only thing that I could come up with, go, man, okay, like how do they get their money?

00:20:34.378 --> 00:21:01.205
basically ah was to per book ah that sort of what if I just do some sketches right Now, and again, I had seen the workmen had done it, and they had done it, and I think, I remember I was talking to Ryan and he done like 24 or something.

00:21:01.334 --> 00:21:05.410
and then all of a sudden, uh he's good.

00:21:05.410 --> 00:21:08.130
24 people gonna buy a thousand copies, cool.

00:21:08.630 --> 00:21:10.321
Like an order for like a hundred.

00:21:10.321 --> 00:21:11.842
or something.

00:21:12.061 --> 00:21:17.281
he was like, I got to do like 75 more.

00:21:17.357 --> 00:21:18.597
and whatever.

00:21:18.597 --> 00:21:28.857
there is a little bit of of, and again, it's, it's, uh, because they're, they're, they're so my, with Robert Kirk, nobody's like, Rod, I don't to draw any of those 75.

00:21:28.938 --> 00:21:29.877
Right.

00:21:30.077 --> 00:21:34.738
So other than saying, Ryan, can you get those 75 extra drawings done?

00:21:34.738 --> 00:21:40.700
But I said, Hey, Why don't I just, maybe I'll do some sketch because you, every time.

00:21:40.700 --> 00:21:56.557
I don't I rarely do them but when do and the odd times somebody puts them up for sale, they go anywhere between two that seems to be the range of what's in there at first I Thousand cop and I just did it.

00:21:56.557 --> 00:21:58.978
Let's do it down.

00:21:58.978 --> 00:22:10.369
But then just recently sketches I went for that 3000 ring is going said, so how much is it going to cost them by a thousand?

00:22:11.150 --> 00:22:18.772
I go, OK, even at like two dollars, thousand, I go to get a get and they can sell it even for one.

00:22:18.772 --> 00:22:20.534
Then they get their money back.

00:22:20.534 --> 00:22:32.529
they get a book if there's only a hundred people that buy this or 50 people to buy that I'm gonna get a book of which there's only 50 copies or a hundred copies right so that still they're going to have a book.

00:22:32.529 --> 00:22:43.369
that's $400 and then they get one and two fifties and they'll net them another $200 bucks.

00:22:44.009 --> 00:22:50.450
But suddenly they started doing the math going, oh man, maybe they get their money.

00:22:50.609 --> 00:22:51.250
Right?

00:22:51.250 --> 00:22:57.029
And so if that's the problem, it's true, then they're going to order a lot.

00:22:57.029 --> 00:23:02.178
Now I said I would, cause I, only 10 people would do it, but I go, I'll do the first 50.

00:23:02.178 --> 00:23:02.438
Right.

00:23:02.438 --> 00:23:10.298
So, and then after that I've got like Brett Booth and Barbara and the Segovia.

00:23:11.198 --> 00:23:18.519
At that point, if there's any more than 50, then it becomes You put it in a pool, you mix it all up and then it just becomes random.

00:23:18.660 --> 00:23:25.864
So technically if there was a hundred people that order, you got a one, two chance of getting a sketch from me.

00:23:26.523 --> 00:23:34.387
I tell you the knock it out of the box because they're going to try and not want to do something.

00:23:35.348 --> 00:23:35.778
Right.

00:23:35.778 --> 00:23:44.723
So they're going to, they're going to put stuff out there until, and then, the thing is a little scratchy thing, but I, I don't.

00:23:45.801 --> 00:24:07.986
don't I way less than this, right?

00:24:07.986 --> 00:24:11.445
So I'll sneak a couple here real quick to you.

00:24:12.791 --> 00:24:15.923
So this is like a, this is like a, just a pencil sketch, right?

00:24:15.923 --> 00:24:17.278
Boom, boom, boom, boom.

00:24:17.625 --> 00:24:22.086
then I come to do.

00:24:26.359 --> 00:24:34.642
So just to describe this to the listener as well, we've got a, like a, like a, a bust of spawn inked then we have a violator bust as well.

00:24:34.642 --> 00:24:38.615
So again, And again, trying to put a decent amount of lines on it.

00:24:38.615 --> 00:24:39.597
They look awesome.

00:24:39.597 --> 00:24:41.006
again, peace.

00:24:41.006 --> 00:24:47.711
um to do, there's enough noodling, like my style.

00:24:47.854 --> 00:24:49.758
instead of just like some big clunk.

00:24:49.758 --> 00:24:56.238
that I do sometimes when some kid asks me for a quick sketch or something says, I love venom or something.

00:24:56.238 --> 00:24:57.317
And I do it.

00:24:57.458 --> 00:25:00.258
hopefully, think they're going to...

00:25:00.258 --> 00:25:05.144
worth their time, but then again, I'm guessing it'd be a big.

00:25:05.144 --> 00:25:08.470
of people that will end up going some of the bigger retail.

00:25:10.028 --> 00:25:11.768
I'm also going to be doing that.

00:25:11.768 --> 00:25:14.878
for Kingspawn gunslinger.

00:25:14.878 --> 00:25:21.902
and the scorch because what I wanted to do and this is going back to sort of marketing is that let's.

00:25:21.902 --> 00:25:26.122
Create a program and then whatever the program is, rinse and repeat.

00:25:26.122 --> 00:25:27.090
for the other 50.

00:25:27.090 --> 00:25:31.367
So it's 50-50-50, but the message is exactly the same.

00:25:31.448 --> 00:25:34.461
So once I get the message across.

00:25:34.759 --> 00:25:37.877
how it works for the first one.

00:25:37.877 --> 00:25:45.948
then the retailers and the consumers will then have knowledge of going, oh, so Gunslanger is going to be doing kind of the same thing.

00:25:45.948 --> 00:25:53.919
And then you can decide whether that's a good, bad, or indifferent thing, but at least same.

00:25:53.919 --> 00:25:57.740
So if you like m it three times if you don't, you're not going to like.

00:25:58.363 --> 00:26:00.255
We've got some cool people coming on.

00:26:00.255 --> 00:26:11.505
some covers and you know fun with all of it so and I'm doing you know I'll never sign again Just I don't know.

00:26:11.505 --> 00:26:12.476
We'll see again.

00:26:12.476 --> 00:26:16.450
It's not issue 100 of each one of them, which are to me.

00:26:16.794 --> 00:26:17.549
And.

00:26:17.549 --> 00:26:18.289
box, right?

00:26:18.289 --> 00:26:21.990
We all, we were collecting, you know, 100, 400, 300, whatever.

00:26:21.990 --> 00:26:23.390
They're all cool numbers.

00:26:24.269 --> 00:26:28.250
He says, you who, we're still here, right?

00:26:28.250 --> 00:26:29.173
Thus.

00:26:29.173 --> 00:26:30.780
Don't take us for granted.

00:26:30.780 --> 00:26:33.900
Maybe even somewhere between 50 and a hundred you do.

00:26:33.900 --> 00:26:37.211
little bit of an event story or some big story.

00:26:37.211 --> 00:26:42.256
So that again, you just keep reminding people, raising your hand going, hey, I'm still here in the corner.

00:26:43.397 --> 00:26:56.500
That onus is on us, people who, the boy, on the character, it's a burden to do the work, right?

00:26:56.500 --> 00:27:07.846
So When I talk to my peers and at Image, they're doing books at Image, my creative And I go, for me, and then maybe I'm just an odd duck, and maybe I'm just old.

00:27:07.987 --> 00:27:10.455
had big successes.

00:27:10.455 --> 00:27:25.726
uh sales on issue number one, ah that's interesting to me because you don't do a lot to get what should give you the thrill is how do get people about issues?

00:27:26.016 --> 00:27:29.226
And then once you get eight, then what about 20?

00:27:29.999 --> 00:27:34.162
And like, and so it'll keep you engaged to go, do I?

00:27:34.162 --> 00:27:35.923
And then, then, yeah, man.

00:27:35.923 --> 00:27:38.486
And by 37, the next thing you know, you're at 50.

00:27:38.704 --> 00:27:39.506
You're at 50.

00:27:39.506 --> 00:27:47.718
So Instead of worrying about the low hang and froak, issue number one with 10 cover, anybody can sell that to someone.

00:27:47.920 --> 00:27:48.782
Right?

00:27:48.782 --> 00:27:50.186
Start thinking out.

00:27:50.186 --> 00:28:07.001
later down the line to again to raise your hand to remind people and that it's and on a regular basis and eventually you will get that sort of they go, hey, there's 35.

00:28:07.304 --> 00:28:08.683
Say they're all perfect.

00:28:08.683 --> 00:28:11.045
But the majority of them are really good.

00:28:11.045 --> 00:28:13.162
And I like the book.

00:28:13.162 --> 00:28:14.086
it.

00:28:14.086 --> 00:28:16.545
And I like the character, whatever it is.

00:28:16.826 --> 00:28:19.086
Jeopardy is the thing.

00:28:20.248 --> 00:28:22.367
I'm just like, I see it.

00:28:22.367 --> 00:28:32.165
About Ozzy Osbourne, Ozzy Osbourne kiss, you know, sort of people rolling stones, we can talk about.

00:28:32.246 --> 00:28:35.805
whether they're the best at their craft.

00:28:36.448 --> 00:28:54.425
a long time and have a long big, but what you can't deny, all of those, despite where you rank their talent, have survived for decades in Shark and Fest.

00:28:54.665 --> 00:29:04.660
And the reason they're Shark and Fest is because everybody coming in is a new competitor and they want to take your spot and that you can survive for decades.

00:29:05.142 --> 00:29:14.089
victory and if you can survive for decades and be relevant, the second piece, then that to me is matter.

00:29:14.411 --> 00:29:19.915
I understand now as my career gets longer how hard that is.

00:29:19.915 --> 00:29:21.246
It's not easy.

00:29:21.266 --> 00:29:24.827
I work at it every day to maintain that.

00:29:24.827 --> 00:29:28.088
And because why nobody else needs to do it.

00:29:28.088 --> 00:29:29.709
It's all my burden.

00:29:30.369 --> 00:29:30.859
I don't know.

00:29:30.859 --> 00:29:31.319
It's weird.

00:29:31.319 --> 00:29:39.492
I like it said, sometimes I talk to my peers and it's like they sort of are looking for and it's in my 40 years being in business.

00:29:39.492 --> 00:29:43.928
There's not a lot of them because I'd be taking them myself and honestly, I'd be taking them.

00:29:43.928 --> 00:29:44.685
So.

00:29:44.814 --> 00:29:46.773
You know, lot to unpack there.

00:29:46.773 --> 00:29:47.413
I'll say Todd.

00:29:47.413 --> 00:29:52.574
The first thing that I was thinking as you were talking about this about like, how do you sell an issue eight or at issue 21?

00:29:52.574 --> 00:29:53.294
Here's a better question.

00:29:53.294 --> 00:29:55.534
How do you sell a Batman for 23?

00:29:55.534 --> 00:29:59.673
You know, you could just make Todd draw one of the most iconic Batman covers of all time.

00:29:59.673 --> 00:30:01.678
And I think it sells pretty well at that point, right?

00:30:01.678 --> 00:30:03.117
But you don't know though.

00:30:03.878 --> 00:30:04.528
You don't know.

00:30:04.528 --> 00:30:13.040
It's like somebody comes in and I mean, you know, so these are the serendipitous moments where we've all had them.

00:30:13.040 --> 00:30:16.690
Every phone rings and they go, Hey, Todd, you want to do a Batman cover?

00:30:16.690 --> 00:30:18.442
I'm like, yeah, that'd be cool.

00:30:19.803 --> 00:30:22.023
In the middle of some other project.

00:30:22.763 --> 00:30:23.463
Yeah, cool.

00:30:23.463 --> 00:30:27.965
When you need it and they go, well, the reason we're phoning you are cover artists just dropped out.

00:30:27.965 --> 00:30:29.518
So is there any way you can get it to us?

00:30:29.518 --> 00:30:30.915
Oh damn.

00:30:30.915 --> 00:30:32.974
Right?

00:30:33.039 --> 00:30:35.894
look at again, I keep telling people, look at that cover.

00:30:35.894 --> 00:30:39.394
You can tell that's an editor phoning me saying I need it tomorrow.

00:30:40.273 --> 00:30:44.233
I mean, if they said, Hey, you had days that cover looks completely different.

00:30:44.233 --> 00:30:49.913
That was like, and I, so I looked at my, my watch is probably about noon at that time.

00:30:49.913 --> 00:30:50.794
don't know.

00:30:51.034 --> 00:30:53.874
And I go, Oh, I've got six, seven hours to get this out.

00:30:53.874 --> 00:30:55.314
Cause I got to get it in the mail in the morning.

00:30:55.314 --> 00:30:57.953
Cause I lived on an island and you have to get it in the, in the morning.

00:30:57.953 --> 00:31:03.880
I go, I've got, can I draw and make it look interesting but get it done in six hours.

00:31:03.982 --> 00:31:04.803
That's it.

00:31:04.803 --> 00:31:06.404
That was what that is.

00:31:06.404 --> 00:31:10.750
Now, the odd ends up.

00:31:10.826 --> 00:31:19.286
this life now 20 years because the thing that's Is that nobody made a big deal about it?

00:31:19.286 --> 00:31:35.566
It seems to have gotten like this new birth energy And I think because Batman obviously did care I a lot of people went Batman 423 I collect Batman?

00:31:35.566 --> 00:31:37.227
I gotta- got boxes of them.

00:31:37.227 --> 00:31:40.367
And then I think they all like, shit, I got that one too.

00:31:40.367 --> 00:31:40.628
Right.

00:31:40.628 --> 00:31:42.398
Because it's coming out a lot more.

00:31:42.398 --> 00:31:48.031
And when I'm signing, it's now becoming one of the handful go to boys.

00:31:48.512 --> 00:31:50.394
And I said, where'd all these come from?

00:31:50.394 --> 00:32:00.263
Cause I know the print run wasn't very big, but I think everybody who had a Batman collection, You went, I got that, I guess, and they do.

00:32:00.263 --> 00:32:02.847
Pull it out and you get a sign.

00:32:02.847 --> 00:32:07.422
Well, to speak on the longevity of longevity of it all and I keep going back to this Brian K.

00:32:07.422 --> 00:32:12.306
Vaughn conversation after this conversation, Todd, it's my all time favorite conversation that I've ever had here on the show.

00:32:12.306 --> 00:32:22.544
So that we've ever had on the show with Brian, but we got on this exact topic actually about how a lot of creator own books nowadays often don't go the distance, we'll say.

00:32:22.544 --> 00:32:22.733
Right.

00:32:22.733 --> 00:32:24.465
And Brian is sort of known for that throughout his career.

00:32:24.465 --> 00:32:28.499
Obviously you are as well with not only these three titles, but you know, spawning there on.

00:32:28.499 --> 00:32:32.541
So I'm just curious from your, from your point of view.

00:32:32.652 --> 00:32:36.924
What is that secret sauce that you have to have in order to keep an ongoing going?

00:32:37.314 --> 00:32:42.155
think there is a secret sauce, think, and this may seem like an odd answer.

00:32:42.155 --> 00:32:51.653
I coach kids baseball and sports for a long time at a high level, like from five all the way up to 17, right?

00:32:52.017 --> 00:32:54.638
And I repeated the same thing almost every year.

00:32:55.461 --> 00:32:56.852
Most of was bass.

00:32:57.029 --> 00:33:00.816
three things, three things I can't teach you.

00:33:00.816 --> 00:33:01.715
Right?

00:33:02.637 --> 00:33:03.798
But, that's it.

00:33:04.280 --> 00:33:08.383
Throw harder, but either they and then.

00:33:08.383 --> 00:33:09.703
here's the third one.

00:33:09.703 --> 00:33:11.525
I can't teach them.

00:33:12.526 --> 00:33:19.290
They either want to hustle because they just know innately, fuck, I just want to be the best one on this field.

00:33:19.511 --> 00:33:19.902
Right?

00:33:19.902 --> 00:33:22.114
Or I just don't want to embarrass myself.

00:33:22.114 --> 00:33:23.675
Or I just don't want anybody laughing at me.

00:33:23.675 --> 00:33:24.226
mean, whatever.

00:33:24.226 --> 00:33:25.887
It's just a, it's a personality.

00:33:25.887 --> 00:33:26.371
It's a.

00:33:26.371 --> 00:33:27.575
have that dog in you.

00:33:28.157 --> 00:33:29.739
Yes, it's in there.

00:33:29.739 --> 00:33:30.398
It's in there.

00:33:30.398 --> 00:33:33.730
ah You can't put it in that because that's a personality.

00:33:33.730 --> 00:33:35.342
This is going back to that thing thing.

00:33:35.342 --> 00:33:36.201
It's a personality.

00:33:36.201 --> 00:33:42.266
So how do you get to a big you, you have to have a personality.

00:33:42.266 --> 00:33:49.489
And we often use that mind closer bordering to sort of insane.

00:33:49.534 --> 00:33:53.114
like doing 370 issues of their own damn book.

00:33:53.114 --> 00:33:54.794
That's ridiculous.

00:33:57.433 --> 00:34:00.076
I'm not saying you got to go all the way.

00:34:00.076 --> 00:34:00.547
one.

00:34:00.547 --> 00:34:06.551
Because I remember Robert Kirkland when he quit walking dead at 190, goes, Todd, to go all the way up to 300.

00:34:06.551 --> 00:34:11.916
we were just about ready to set the record on spot.

00:34:12.297 --> 00:34:13.318
My head, right?

00:34:13.318 --> 00:34:16.050
Like he's like, goes, I can't go another.

00:34:16.141 --> 00:34:21.184
120 issues, like that's, I have to commit 10 more years.

00:34:21.184 --> 00:34:28.023
So to get to those numbers, what you have to do is just say, I'm gonna, we're like going to the gym.

00:34:28.023 --> 00:34:32.150
Look at, I was never, I was never a gym rat, I was an athlete.

00:34:32.150 --> 00:34:38.972
I can honestly say I never went to the gym once and walked face going, man, that was super awesome.

00:34:38.972 --> 00:34:40.014
That was good.

00:34:40.014 --> 00:34:42.996
It was a means to an end.

00:34:42.996 --> 00:34:48.673
If you want it to be in shape and you want it to look good, you went there as part of a regiment.

00:34:48.673 --> 00:34:49.923
That was it.

00:34:51.545 --> 00:34:55.208
And you don't worry about anything else other than getting to it.

00:34:55.208 --> 00:35:09.858
So some people, have uh sort of tortoise mentality, if you will, and then other people are, and they want to get that faster and enjoy it then do it again and replicate it.

00:35:09.858 --> 00:35:15.101
So I know lots of people that five, 10 issues of their own book and then come up with another idea.

00:35:15.170 --> 00:35:23.992
I'm going to assume because they're excited about the next idea and they want to get it out and they don't want to go to the with it not coming out.

00:35:23.992 --> 00:35:43.889
And if they just stayed on that one idea, then they might not get the others out or a combo of they saw some of the sales starting to flag and they just go, I need to get on another horse instead of like sort of sort of through the ups and downs.

00:35:43.889 --> 00:35:48.590
Look at it, guys, I'm 307 into spawn.

00:35:48.590 --> 00:35:52.101
You think that has just been a constant up?

00:35:53.197 --> 00:35:56.501
It's been ups, down, way downs, up.

00:35:56.501 --> 00:35:58.983
It's been a constant up and down.

00:35:58.983 --> 00:36:03.543
And you just, it's it's been endurance.

00:36:03.543 --> 00:36:07.885
And then all of sudden you can say you got 170 issues.

00:36:07.885 --> 00:36:10.740
Then the cycle comes around and you're in faith.

00:36:10.740 --> 00:36:13.206
for a little while until you're not.

00:36:13.206 --> 00:36:15.565
And then you have to ask yourself if not.

00:36:15.565 --> 00:36:20.865
And then you have to kind of, things to reinvent it a bit, keep coming around.

00:36:20.994 --> 00:36:22.023
I don't know.

00:36:24.206 --> 00:36:28.715
It's a big combo, it's a big combo, but doing 50 issues is four.

00:36:28.715 --> 00:36:30.385
years and two months.

00:36:30.427 --> 00:36:31.766
It's just math.

00:36:31.766 --> 00:36:34.447
It's four years and two months.

00:36:36.829 --> 00:36:45.911
Of my peers, industry for four years or thousands of them.

00:36:46.213 --> 00:36:46.733
of them.

00:36:46.733 --> 00:36:56.956
em I can only count on fingers the number of them who put 50 issues on their side of the line.

00:36:56.956 --> 00:37:05.909
I put 50 issues in the corporate and they did the Justice League of America for Batman.

00:37:07.597 --> 00:37:12.557
or justice or avenger for somebody else.

00:37:12.557 --> 00:37:16.637
They just along the way didn't try and do it for themselves once.

00:37:16.637 --> 00:37:18.637
It's a weird thing.

00:37:18.637 --> 00:37:23.985
And maybe it's because I know how good it can be.

00:37:23.985 --> 00:37:26.920
you can get work.

00:37:26.920 --> 00:37:33.018
sprint versus marathon mentality, but also having the backing of the publishers to do that.

00:37:33.320 --> 00:37:36.664
Well, look, everybody, right?

00:37:36.664 --> 00:37:40.043
There's a bit of malaise in sort of comic book sales now.

00:37:40.043 --> 00:37:42.032
post the pandemic.

00:37:44.693 --> 00:37:45.755
coming down.

00:37:45.755 --> 00:37:48.659
Again, higher than where they were pre-pandemic.

00:37:48.659 --> 00:37:49.920
it's still on that.

00:37:50.081 --> 00:37:56.347
But at some point, if you're doing your own book and you've got three kids and you need to feed the baby.

00:37:56.347 --> 00:37:59.465
I get it, that you just...

00:37:59.547 --> 00:38:01.070
man, I don't really know.

00:38:01.070 --> 00:38:09.764
There's still a bit of an unknown if I do my own book or whatever else, or I can take the sure thing and go do Captain America and I know what my page, and I know what I'm getting.

00:38:09.764 --> 00:38:12.818
And by the way, the sales there might be a bit more.

00:38:12.818 --> 00:38:18.311
mean, I don't get the money like I would if I was doing my but I get exposure.

00:38:18.311 --> 00:38:19.353
my name and brand.

00:38:19.353 --> 00:38:22.744
So I'm not saying one way is better.

00:38:22.744 --> 00:38:24.054
than the other.

00:38:25.059 --> 00:38:28.184
There's a lot of for everybody to do whatever.

00:38:28.184 --> 00:38:37.581
It's where the peers want what I have or what Rob Kirkman have and somehow think.

00:38:37.581 --> 00:38:40.478
there's a shortcut to it.

00:38:40.478 --> 00:38:46.157
Al Robert got there or how I got there or even some of other people got the 50 Brian came on being there.

00:38:46.157 --> 00:38:46.570
None of it.

00:38:46.570 --> 00:38:48.568
We just put your head down and get 50 issues out.

00:38:48.568 --> 00:38:49.561
Good, bad, or indifferent.

00:38:49.561 --> 00:38:50.534
That's it.

00:38:50.699 --> 00:38:51.318
That's it.

00:38:51.318 --> 00:38:52.960
It's an easy lesson.

00:38:53.981 --> 00:38:59.204
Well, speaking of getting there, I wouldn't forgive myself if we had you here today, Todd.

00:38:59.204 --> 00:39:08.471
And I didn't ask you at least one Greg Capullo question, who just happens to be one of my all time favorite artists in comics.

00:39:08.471 --> 00:39:11.413
I'm a huge, huge death metal fan.

00:39:11.413 --> 00:39:19.065
You two recently teamed up on Batman Spawn, which I think I've searched high and low for almost every cover I could find of that.

00:39:19.065 --> 00:39:20.547
for the Batman Spawn crossover.

00:39:20.547 --> 00:39:29.956
to go back even further, Greg was brought into the Spawn universe at a pivotal time in the book's infancy at issue 16 with Grant Morrison during the anti-spawn storyline.

00:39:29.956 --> 00:39:40.204
In your own words, and feel free to brag about your friend for however long you'd like, what is the special sauce that Greg Capullo brings to the comic book world that no one else can replicate?

00:39:41.697 --> 00:39:43.490
There is a guy named John Biasema.

00:39:43.490 --> 00:39:47.418
that was a big idol for many, many, of us.

00:39:47.608 --> 00:40:05.092
john bassem the magic that he could do and most people would know his work regular comic book and or the Savage Sword of Conan, the black and white book, their stuff, you know, you name it pretty much.

00:40:05.092 --> 00:40:09.893
John put his mark on it, did a bunch of Thor, some Avengers stuff.

00:40:10.514 --> 00:40:13.894
do yourself a favor if you've never sort of paid attention to him.

00:40:13.894 --> 00:40:15.215
Look at his work.

00:40:15.516 --> 00:40:25.987
Did what Greg does is that he could take, he had control and mastery over the body and anatomy.

00:40:25.987 --> 00:40:29.398
we are try to get some proficiency in that.

00:40:30.101 --> 00:40:33.726
Some people who just have it in that category.

00:40:35.117 --> 00:40:42.501
Here's the hard piece, because where my limits are and I just go, I'm so jealous that people can do that.

00:40:42.501 --> 00:40:45.744
They can take the one element, the super.

00:40:46.403 --> 00:40:58.510
And then they can move the camera any angle, low, in, close, far, and change the perspective, and it all look good.

00:40:58.510 --> 00:41:01.652
And in some cases, damn it.

00:41:01.652 --> 00:41:11.277
And then he has that curvy, the big hands, big, know, bright, American.

00:41:11.277 --> 00:41:20.958
kind of a superhero kind of And then combine all that and those, like every time I sort of add a piece, I go, this is why he's special.

00:41:20.958 --> 00:41:23.577
Is that you go, okay, there's only a few people who can do that.

00:41:23.577 --> 00:41:31.478
And then that and that and that and that and that and then take all of that, add volume of.

00:41:31.657 --> 00:41:41.460
So he's doing it by proficiency and he's turning it out on a Big.

00:41:41.460 --> 00:41:56.025
level of the amount of pages and that's what your summer did that's what I'm not saying he's but I'm saying that work in compared to some of the sort of talk.

00:41:56.766 --> 00:41:58.057
He's the full package.

00:41:58.057 --> 00:42:02.577
If you were going to start a comic book company and you go, what is important?

00:42:02.577 --> 00:42:10.315
And what's important is getting the and getting them out on time and making them has as long to look at his part.

00:42:10.596 --> 00:42:13.429
Then Greg Kapoor has to be on your list.

00:42:13.429 --> 00:42:18.768
He has to because he's the one that delivers on those.

00:42:18.768 --> 00:42:20.641
aspects, right?

00:42:20.641 --> 00:42:26.505
So I mean, I'm constantly for do a monthly book.

00:42:26.505 --> 00:42:36.650
And then if they're skilled, part two, like I don't care, because I got a monthly book I put out, I need people to help me with monthly books.

00:42:36.692 --> 00:42:40.193
It's like, my God, you're going to do a monthly?

00:42:41.313 --> 00:42:45.155
And some cases when he's on his A game, he's great.

00:42:45.155 --> 00:42:46.496
Where's the clone?

00:42:46.878 --> 00:42:47.878
We need 20.

00:42:47.878 --> 00:42:49.597
got a like that.

00:42:50.039 --> 00:42:50.550
Let me ask you this.

00:42:50.550 --> 00:43:00.038
I was going to say he draws like an ideal house style version of every major character in comics, but would you consider Greg like a house uh style type of artist?

00:43:00.038 --> 00:43:03.193
Is that the best way to describe his work?

00:43:03.277 --> 00:43:05.228
uh I don't know.

00:43:05.228 --> 00:43:12.483
think because he's been so good and so consistent with that, think oddly you could maybe make that comment with that.

00:43:12.483 --> 00:43:26.311
think he is somebody if you were going to break into comic books and want to do superhero comic books, not moody dark stuff, not esoteric stuff, like just good old fashioned superhero stuff.

00:43:26.311 --> 00:43:28.032
He's a guy, yes, you should be looking at.

00:43:28.032 --> 00:43:31.873
Just like look, John Biasema when we were kids.

00:43:31.873 --> 00:43:39.157
uh and has to be on that list of.

00:43:39.253 --> 00:43:39.445
yeah.

00:43:39.445 --> 00:43:40.856
Yeah, there's how you do.

00:43:40.856 --> 00:43:42.458
dynamic stuff, right?

00:43:42.458 --> 00:43:45.990
I used look at lot of John Byrne stuff, because his stuff was...

00:43:46.612 --> 00:43:46.922
Right?

00:43:46.922 --> 00:43:47.278
had...

00:43:47.278 --> 00:43:50.945
energy, you could move people around in the characters and move the characters.

00:43:50.945 --> 00:43:52.543
around and stuff like that.

00:43:52.543 --> 00:43:55.532
there was a guy, Garcia Lopez.

00:43:55.532 --> 00:43:56.614
He could do it too.

00:43:56.614 --> 00:43:58.235
Sadly, he never got.

00:43:58.710 --> 00:43:59.610
Never.

00:43:59.610 --> 00:44:09.856
turned out the volume of work to let people see his that camera and all his people were beautiful and handsome energy was on the page.

00:44:09.856 --> 00:44:11.797
mostly did stuff for DC.

00:44:11.797 --> 00:44:14.829
at that Perfect Superman is Jose Garcia Lopez.

00:44:14.829 --> 00:44:15.302
Perfect.

00:44:15.302 --> 00:44:18.003
uh Yeah, he's there.

00:44:18.442 --> 00:44:26.474
go okay and then you take like Jorge and is probably, I don't know, I've never talked to him, probably Mr.

00:44:26.474 --> 00:44:27.465
Lopez, right?

00:44:27.465 --> 00:44:39.273
m I maybe he does maybe this seems like that that if I look at Jorge I go I see lobe path, right?

00:44:39.576 --> 00:44:41.947
When I look at Greg, I see Buscema.

00:44:41.947 --> 00:44:45.568
And I'm sure if I talk to Buscema, he goes, oh, I've taken it, this guy.

00:44:46.269 --> 00:44:49.210
Just sort of taking pieces and bringing it down.

00:44:49.210 --> 00:44:54.253
But um a monthly comic.

00:44:54.715 --> 00:45:02.557
And I know there are plenty of people that are doing covers and I have them and they're amazing and fantastic and they're.

00:45:03.278 --> 00:45:07.742
I can do cover artists to me might.

00:45:07.742 --> 00:45:08.652
Harder.

00:45:10.443 --> 00:45:19.583
bit of of a flavor the hottest cover guy for two or three, four, five years, and then somebody else is gonna come along and they're gonna be the new sector.

00:45:20.264 --> 00:45:28.512
You do 20 pages, 20 pages, 20 pages, 20 pages, people go, man, did you see that run?

00:45:28.512 --> 00:45:33.197
There is a reason why Jose Delgado and Alex Sands value.

00:45:33.197 --> 00:45:34.681
uh was a kid.

00:45:34.722 --> 00:45:36.101
They were reliable.

00:45:36.101 --> 00:45:37.242
They were reliable.

00:45:40.461 --> 00:45:44.742
But I knew that everybody, they were.

00:45:45.369 --> 00:45:47.050
they were going to come out.

00:45:47.050 --> 00:45:50.230
there's something to be said about consistency.

00:45:50.717 --> 00:45:59.338
got to you, I know if you guys have ever bought one of the anniversary books that has like, awed me.

00:45:59.338 --> 00:46:06.117
One of the big daredevil book not that long ago.

00:46:06.237 --> 00:46:08.398
This wrote all of it.

00:46:08.657 --> 00:46:11.077
But they had like them.

00:46:11.077 --> 00:46:12.217
Right?

00:46:12.498 --> 00:46:14.217
I didn't look at the credits.

00:46:14.398 --> 00:46:16.556
and I didn't know Brian Bendis.

00:46:16.556 --> 00:46:18.150
wrote all five of them.

00:46:18.637 --> 00:46:26.822
because the art was so different and I was changing the way I was reading to basically accommodate.

00:46:26.822 --> 00:46:28.922
look of the art.

00:46:28.952 --> 00:46:32.483
that I was reading and the inflections were different.

00:46:32.885 --> 00:46:37.186
And then it was only a little, I just wrote that one too.

00:46:38.548 --> 00:46:41.010
And part of it was I didn't really like the artwork.

00:46:41.510 --> 00:46:45.112
Him and Alex Malieve, nailed, nailed.

00:46:45.534 --> 00:46:49.956
But then like Brian attached to this other guy that's okay.

00:46:49.956 --> 00:46:52.818
I'm like, it didn't read as well.

00:46:52.818 --> 00:46:56.161
I thought it brought Brian down to the point I didn't even know it was Brian.

00:46:56.161 --> 00:47:04.155
ah So there's something to be said about like consistency, if you're not, you buy those trade paperback.

00:47:04.155 --> 00:47:07.679
it's the exact art for 20 pages.

00:47:07.900 --> 00:47:09.532
There's a value in that.

00:47:09.532 --> 00:47:10.735
You don't have to be the best.

00:47:10.735 --> 00:47:13.068
just got to be So come on.

00:47:13.534 --> 00:47:17.284
once you get consistent, then you go, huh, well, I'm consistent.

00:47:17.644 --> 00:47:18.706
not 50.

00:47:19.742 --> 00:47:26.809
You just perfectly described, I think maybe the power of comics is that if you have an extremely well written book, but the art is shit, you're not going to like it.

00:47:26.809 --> 00:47:32.096
And also if you have a book that's beautiful, but the words are terrible, you're not going to like it.

00:47:32.096 --> 00:47:33.905
You have to have that beautiful combination.

00:47:33.905 --> 00:47:34.335
I'll check.

00:47:34.335 --> 00:47:35.706
Whoa, whoa, we'll take that one back.

00:47:35.706 --> 00:47:41.898
We'll take that one back, no, no, no, no, no, no, we'll take, shit, I'll buy that book and look at it all day long, over and over over over and over.

00:47:41.898 --> 00:47:44.909
I've got plenty of beautiful books.

00:47:46.090 --> 00:47:48.989
Plenty, and maybe because I'm biased, because I'm an artist.

00:47:49.530 --> 00:47:55.172
No, no, no, I'll buy books like, I could, right?

00:47:55.172 --> 00:47:58.012
go, it's my favorite, it's my favorite character, Wolverine.

00:47:58.012 --> 00:48:01.550
Oh my gosh, Art Adams is drunk, my artist of all time.

00:48:01.550 --> 00:48:04.414
Oh my gosh, and it's got Michael Goldin in it.

00:48:04.414 --> 00:48:08.849
My second favorite R season, it's like, but it's got that writer I don't like.

00:48:08.942 --> 00:48:10.601
Like, what are you talking about?

00:48:10.601 --> 00:48:13.021
I'm buying two copies of that thing.

00:48:13.021 --> 00:48:15.282
So the other way, I agree.

00:48:15.282 --> 00:48:16.862
This is I go to my grave.

00:48:16.862 --> 00:48:20.641
Look at comic books, 51 % of them.

00:48:21.382 --> 00:48:26.561
Look at the cover and then we through it and then we take it to the gas register.

00:48:26.561 --> 00:48:29.998
And only once we have it home, do we then decide.

00:48:29.998 --> 00:48:32.900
whether we like the book as a whole and or the read.

00:48:32.900 --> 00:48:36.681
they've got our money, right?

00:48:36.681 --> 00:48:45.719
So with the words that were in that book, it had to do with somebody likes either the character, the cover, or they were flipping through the art.

00:48:45.719 --> 00:48:50.572
Well, you know, Todd, I tend to go towards your uh view on this topic.

00:48:50.572 --> 00:49:03.958
I don't know if I necessarily have a leg to stand on when it comes to these kind of things, because there are definitely times where I, you know, I will be more apt to buy a book if I see it on the, on the shelf and it's beautiful rather than, you know, reading it first and then putting it back, you know.

00:49:03.976 --> 00:49:07.465
Give me a- dude, did- give me a- extreme one.

00:49:08.653 --> 00:49:11.869
Shakespeare writes a book and my mom draws it.

00:49:12.385 --> 00:49:13.211
Right?

00:49:13.677 --> 00:49:18.846
So my six year old kid writes a story and Michelangelo paints it.

00:49:18.846 --> 00:49:22.829
Which one of those two books you think you're gonna take home if you could only take home one?

00:49:24.534 --> 00:49:27.777
I'm thinking that it's way more Michelangelo.

00:49:27.777 --> 00:49:39.797
oh Well, it's funny that we've sort of transitioned onto this exact topic because our final question for you, Todd, you've been so gracious with your time here today and we appreciate you joining us.

00:49:39.797 --> 00:49:45.240
But I want to sort of go back to this time, early days of Spawn.

00:49:45.240 --> 00:49:46.822
was reading, I have a couple of these different books.

00:49:46.822 --> 00:49:52.327
It's called Writers on Comic Script Writing that I have here where they sort of, they interview folks from back in the day.

00:49:52.327 --> 00:49:54.938
And you're one of, you're actually in the very first edition of this.

00:49:54.938 --> 00:50:01.114
It's like you, you've got like Peter David, Rest In Peace, uh Chuck Dixon, Warren Ellis.

00:50:01.146 --> 00:50:04.219
Jeff Loeb, you, Frank Miller, Grant Morris, and so on.

00:50:04.300 --> 00:50:05.835
man! wow.

00:50:07.085 --> 00:50:08.534
the low man on top of the bomb.

00:50:08.534 --> 00:50:09.396
You're near the bottom here.

00:50:09.396 --> 00:50:10.309
I don't think it's in quality.

00:50:10.309 --> 00:50:12.981
I think it's just because you were one of the last, but they want you to know.

00:50:12.981 --> 00:50:16.277
But I'm going, oh man, those are like jealous.

00:50:18.358 --> 00:50:20.978
I'm actually wondering why they put me in there, Go ahead.

00:51:10.722 --> 00:51:18.257
No, you're over- I knew I was- gonna be writing spawn for a long, long, long, long, long, long time.

00:51:18.257 --> 00:51:29.481
ah There just was a lot of chatter beginning of image where it was like, you guys are just artists, I, and well, we can hire writers.

00:51:30.190 --> 00:51:42.766
Click, done, and we can actually get some of the more high- I hire profile writers, you know, just either just sort of give them a paycheck that would make sense for them.

00:51:42.766 --> 00:51:43.867
Click, right?

00:51:43.867 --> 00:51:46.568
So it's fine, right?

00:51:46.568 --> 00:51:47.652
Here's the odd.

00:51:47.652 --> 00:51:50.635
and we should have it at some point on a bigger scale.

00:51:51.038 --> 00:51:54.324
What is the criteria for reading?

00:51:54.324 --> 00:51:55.489
And again, you can have.

00:51:55.489 --> 00:51:59.132
exact same debate for what makes good art, right?

00:51:59.132 --> 00:52:05.777
Here's what can't It can't be sales.

00:52:05.777 --> 00:52:18.661
If we say all to the criteria, then Todd McFarland is one of the great writers of uh I wrote it.

00:52:18.860 --> 00:52:20.056
Number one song book.

00:52:20.056 --> 00:52:22.590
Does that make me the number one writer?

00:52:22.590 --> 00:52:24.244
In the industry, of course it doesn't.

00:52:24.244 --> 00:52:25.378
Of course it doesn't.

00:52:25.378 --> 00:52:36.822
You and I could come up with a list of people do 2022 number one selling book written by Todd McFarland, Spawn Batman.

00:52:36.822 --> 00:52:41.364
So guys, we've had that piece out of the equation.

00:52:41.364 --> 00:52:53.018
Two years earlier in 2019, number one selling book that was a single book other than of 1000 was Spawn 300301, Todd McFarland.

00:52:53.018 --> 00:52:55.126
So again, the biggest selling book.

00:52:55.126 --> 00:52:59.876
If we want to start saying that writer's good is that they're so on.

00:52:59.876 --> 00:53:00.396
No, no, no.

00:53:00.396 --> 00:53:05.304
The bigger question is given that it was and it's not.

00:53:06.289 --> 00:53:07.074
I did those.

00:53:07.074 --> 00:53:08.778
books sell so much?

00:53:09.003 --> 00:53:11.536
And that brings me to the second part.

00:53:11.958 --> 00:53:14.820
Good marketing and the character.

00:53:14.820 --> 00:53:17.813
All those other things I talked about.

00:53:17.813 --> 00:53:23.030
Get people home before they go, you know, like cutting a good trailer.

00:53:23.030 --> 00:53:23.681
Cut a good trailer.

00:53:23.681 --> 00:53:26.644
You can get people in the theater and then they can say they didn't like it.

00:53:26.644 --> 00:53:28.775
But you kind of did your job because you.

00:53:28.775 --> 00:53:28.855
100%.

00:53:28.855 --> 00:53:37.661
And you know, the, speaking into existence and the legitimization of your operation and that, that effort that goes into doing that is I agree with you 100 % Todd.

00:53:37.661 --> 00:53:41.347
And so thank you for, I thank you so much for like making it, putting that into this conversation.

00:53:41.347 --> 00:53:42.052
Cause it's so true.

00:53:42.052 --> 00:53:52.728
Uh, when Aaron and I first started the show, I think I said this to you, Aaron, within the first couple of months that we started when we were literally yelling into the void that like we need to start doing the show.

00:53:52.728 --> 00:53:57.833
Like we're already that I think sort of help get to that place.

00:53:57.833 --> 00:53:59.795
we already, we're already doing all the right things.

00:53:59.795 --> 00:54:02.003
Like we're already doing all the things that we're doing now.

00:54:02.003 --> 00:54:03.038
They won't change anything.

00:54:03.038 --> 00:54:05.119
That's just the audience that's changed, you know?

00:54:05.119 --> 00:54:08.092
So Todd, we've, we've taken way too much of your time.

00:54:08.092 --> 00:54:14.246
What an absolute honor it was to have you here on the show to talk about spawn and image and marketing and baseball.

00:54:14.246 --> 00:54:15.889
Even we didn't talk enough about baseball, honestly.

00:54:15.889 --> 00:54:17.594
didn't have you back at some point and talk about.

00:54:17.594 --> 00:54:22.054
because he's been around now for a time and that keeps coming back.

00:54:22.054 --> 00:54:23.213
Same conversation.

00:54:23.434 --> 00:54:24.186
Get your...

00:54:24.186 --> 00:54:25.166
done, right?

00:54:25.166 --> 00:54:26.606
They'll talk about you.

00:54:26.606 --> 00:54:28.346
You can get outside the bubble.

00:54:28.346 --> 00:54:31.606
People want to do things in video games and TV and movies.

00:54:31.606 --> 00:54:35.606
Do 370, but you're right?

00:54:35.606 --> 00:54:38.465
So, but that's a crazy amount.

00:54:38.585 --> 00:54:47.306
But what you could do is seven ideas and you'd have 150.

00:54:47.585 --> 00:54:52.253
So you could, you don't have to do 350 of one.

00:54:52.293 --> 00:54:54.733
You don't put all your age in one basket like Todd.

00:54:54.733 --> 00:54:57.153
He's a mad man.

00:54:58.873 --> 00:55:02.753
idea 50, 50 and do your 50.

00:55:02.853 --> 00:55:04.094
Do your idea.

00:55:04.094 --> 00:55:04.773
Cool.

00:55:05.474 --> 00:55:06.893
You could have three of them.

00:55:06.893 --> 00:55:17.130
think it's interesting because Chris and I constantly have this discussion about, you know, like the publishers and the big, you know, October 15th.

00:55:17.130 --> 00:55:20.210
I think FOC is September 22nd, if I'm not mistaken.

00:55:20.210 --> 00:55:30.550
So make sure you guys call your LCS, ask them about this one in 1000 pencil virgin variant project that Todd and Image Comics are all doing and just sort of the expansion.

00:55:31.219 --> 00:55:38.213
that's, I love that you know, for a fact, like that's exactly, you know, what needs to be done to get the name, to get the sale.

00:55:38.213 --> 00:55:40.123
mean, again, sales don't matter.

00:55:40.123 --> 00:55:41.695
It's getting the books out there.

00:55:41.695 --> 00:55:44.333
It's getting the, pay, the books in hands.

00:55:44.333 --> 00:55:49.934
And, you know, I appreciate the fact that you share that same sentiment that we all know that it's about marketing.

00:55:49.934 --> 00:55:57.434
It's about these people, you know, these companies putting in the marketing dollars to get the books out there to keep this industry thriving.

00:55:57.434 --> 00:56:00.233
So I just want to say thank you for having that perspective.

00:56:01.134 --> 00:56:06.434
Before we go to that I went through a gyration.

00:56:07.594 --> 00:56:08.813
And we'll go back a few years.

00:56:08.813 --> 00:56:11.563
I knew that issue 300 of Spawn was going to come out.

00:56:11.563 --> 00:56:13.121
and I knew we were heading.

00:56:13.186 --> 00:56:15.842
towards not only an anniversary, but then I went.

00:56:15.842 --> 00:56:18.505
Hey, internally, nobody was paying attention to it.

00:56:18.505 --> 00:56:21.547
Nobody cared that I'm going to care about.

00:56:21.547 --> 00:56:25.291
So my job, get them to kind of care about.

00:56:25.733 --> 00:56:27.135
So I go, we're going to get the 300.

00:56:27.135 --> 00:56:30.777
Now is it an adverse?

00:56:30.838 --> 00:56:37.525
Also, it's 300 like, like, I need to to make that.

00:56:40.846 --> 00:56:46.945
Because it's just another thing to add to the story and what people like is to be able tell.

00:56:47.925 --> 00:56:54.846
It's like, okay, so we've got 300, but ties it and then 301 then breaks it.

00:56:54.846 --> 00:56:58.626
So we get there and then I'm gonna go get Guinness and I'm gonna see if I can get them to give.

00:56:58.846 --> 00:57:00.445
Because it will legitimate.

00:57:00.766 --> 00:57:02.646
Okay, check.

00:57:02.646 --> 00:57:09.130
And then from the retailers, I'm gonna put guys like Greg and Scott Campbell.

00:57:09.130 --> 00:57:12.452
and Jason, Sean, Alex, and I'm gonna put a group of people on there.

00:57:12.452 --> 00:57:15.652
these are people that can check, so I'm gonna make it easy for you.

00:57:15.652 --> 00:57:24.938
But then I even went further, I went on the other side and issued, I think it was 297, I did basically readers.com.

00:57:25.014 --> 00:57:26.711
issue that was...

00:57:26.711 --> 00:57:35.588
For anybody who has not read 296, read this issue and you're caught up, right?

00:57:35.588 --> 00:57:43.603
And then 298 and 299 were like kind of like a prequel leading up to it.

00:57:43.603 --> 00:57:46.516
Now, why do I say all that?

00:57:46.516 --> 00:57:53.771
Because I, and this is maybe going back to what you guys were saying sometimes, big two, that they go, we got issue 300.

00:57:53.771 --> 00:57:58.659
leading into, guess, again, New York Comic Con going up into the into the early October time frame.

00:57:58.659 --> 00:58:03.880
them, there's a record coming, sell them to them and get them.

00:58:05.001 --> 00:58:14.646
The prequel for the next two months, sell them the big anniversary book, but that's not even the record setter, then sell them 301 because there's.

00:58:14.646 --> 00:58:23.702
have to sort of, I can give you a reason why if you can tell the story as good as I can, that you can get people to buy for the next.

00:58:23.702 --> 00:58:24.273
months.

00:58:24.273 --> 00:58:30.525
This, this, book and here's a reason and you've got a story and you get people going.

00:58:30.525 --> 00:58:36.106
Or I guess I could have just gone, oh, 300, we got some big sales, did a bunch of coverage.

00:58:37.266 --> 00:59:00.760
No, and then even from 301 was I did those covers with Jerome LaPena and people were asking me like, and my answer was, because I knew, I knew this one, you know, so it was like, so I of our good friends in the industry, Danny Earls, is doing the coverage for that upcoming Sam and Twitch book, and we're very excited to have that.

00:59:00.760 --> 00:59:03.322
Todd, what an honor.

00:59:03.322 --> 00:59:04.092
Thank you so much.

00:59:04.092 --> 00:59:04.713
We appreciate it.

00:59:04.713 --> 00:59:10.297
Hopefully we can have you back on the show at some point down the road, but until then, hopefully we'll see you at New York Comic Con here in a couple of weeks.

00:59:10.297 --> 00:59:10.985
universe.

00:59:10.985 --> 00:59:20.481
if anytime you like characters, some characters more than Spawn, I would point to 301, sort of like the record.

00:59:20.481 --> 00:59:23.461
And keep going back and say, that was the record book.

00:59:24.289 --> 00:59:34.820
get to say big over and over and over and right that people then look at I don't say this for bragging I'm just for facts, right?

00:59:34.820 --> 00:59:37.505
I've got a Grammy, right?

00:59:38.567 --> 00:59:52.545
Or anybody who doesn't know anything about what I do and somebody go, oh yeah, you know, that guy's got an Emmy and a Grammy and instantly they will give me credit for something because why those words to them.

00:59:52.726 --> 01:00:06.606
so record setting, anniversary, the biggest, the number one, this, the number one, that all of that matters when you are having conversations with retailers, consumers, or you're trying to sell your.

01:00:06.606 --> 01:00:08.594
stuff on a shirt or in a movie, right?

01:00:08.594 --> 01:00:10.431
Like you have to be.

01:00:11.380 --> 01:00:13.782
to hype your own stuff.

01:00:13.884 --> 01:00:16.126
And at some point, it's not a lie.

01:00:16.126 --> 01:00:20.853
It's like it was the number one book, it did do this, whatever, go take a look.

01:00:20.853 --> 01:00:23.498
And they can go, oh, okay, fine.

01:00:23.498 --> 01:00:26.632
The whole becomes way more valuable than the part.

01:00:29.134 --> 01:00:35.083
That's like, okay, so I try not to be myopic on let's just jump this one thing.

01:00:35.083 --> 01:00:37.527
How do we take it and spread the message aside?

01:00:37.527 --> 01:00:39.548
That's why it's called 50-50-50.

01:00:40.811 --> 01:00:42.914
I didn't do something for Kingspawn.

01:00:42.914 --> 01:00:44.706
I go, guys, there's a way to connect.

01:00:44.706 --> 01:00:45.748
all three of these.

01:00:45.748 --> 01:00:46.630
Boom, boom, boom.

01:00:46.630 --> 01:00:47.650
Let's go.

01:01:40.097 --> 01:01:41.153
Yesterday, yesterday.

01:01:41.153 --> 01:01:48.349
there's two for two, single double, four RBI, two still, and two walks and two steals.

01:01:48.349 --> 01:01:50.768
And I'm playing against third year old.

01:01:50.768 --> 01:01:52.242
I'm playing hardball.

01:01:54.157 --> 01:02:03.878
Oh, here I just like to the LA area and my son found the league because he's 25 and then it won.

01:02:03.898 --> 01:02:04.737
They were short.

01:02:04.737 --> 01:02:10.257
So it was like you got to play and I had a good game and they were like, you want to play forever?

01:02:11.077 --> 01:02:16.398
So I play with the I play with the 30 year olds and yesterday I showed up the 30 year old.

01:02:16.398 --> 01:02:18.898
but anyway, so next week they'll show me up.

01:02:18.898 --> 01:02:22.976
But like it's just because again, I just think we're to let's go.

01:02:22.976 --> 01:02:23.286
can.

01:02:23.286 --> 01:02:23.505
it.

01:02:23.505 --> 01:02:24.766
We can do it.

01:02:24.766 --> 01:02:27.605
If you're going to go, do it.

01:02:27.905 --> 01:02:29.045
So anyways.

01:02:53.452 --> 01:02:55.239
If I can f***ing apply- props too.

01:02:55.239 --> 01:02:58.382
we got like Mark Spears is a cover for each one of them.

01:02:58.382 --> 01:02:58.643
Right?

01:02:58.643 --> 01:03:00.434
For the 50-50-50.

01:03:00.434 --> 01:03:02.686
Scotty Young is doing a cover.

01:03:02.686 --> 01:03:04.789
I just got him in for the 50-50-50.

01:03:05.550 --> 01:03:07.309
and his all interconnect.

01:03:07.309 --> 01:03:08.210
Right?

01:03:08.210 --> 01:03:10.710
Are you doing a three?

01:03:10.750 --> 01:03:13.269
In fact, they're so I'm not even gonna put logos on them.

01:03:13.269 --> 01:03:14.690
I'm gonna do them virgin.

01:03:14.690 --> 01:03:15.610
Nice.

01:03:15.782 --> 01:03:45.047
So again, if you just don't want to spend money on the silly one and two books and all the autographs stuff like that there's but the regular books I think are gonna be a dollar more or something like that because we're gonna have it's good double size but it's oversized and I've got some pretty people helping me out on on the covers and then and then there's two stories that are running parallel and it's going to be the same artist.

01:03:45.047 --> 01:03:46.641
all three of them in the 50-50.

01:03:46.641 --> 01:03:50.146
So Carlo Barbary is doing sort of the A stories.

01:03:50.146 --> 01:04:02.157
Technically chapters one, And then via is doing, Steven Segovia is doing chapters for it to be one and five, three and six.

01:04:02.237 --> 01:04:06.677
I those two actually tied together somehow.

01:04:06.677 --> 01:04:14.418
So again, I would buy the 50 50 50 that the artwork will be consistent with those two guys.

01:04:20.652 --> 01:04:24.956
I assume there's going to be some big announcements, some events happening in New York Comic Con?

01:04:24.956 --> 01:04:27.728
Yeah, we'll be there.

01:04:27.728 --> 01:04:32.153
I mean, you know, we go there and do silly stuff.

01:04:32.153 --> 01:04:37.097
yeah, we'll go there, make some announcements and I don't know if there's any.

01:04:37.186 --> 01:04:38.190
giant one.

01:04:38.190 --> 01:04:40.081
The thing is, once I get done with the end...

01:04:40.081 --> 01:04:43.143
50 50 by coincidence, we run right into spawn 375.

01:04:43.143 --> 01:04:45.164
There you go.

01:04:45.164 --> 01:04:56.447
Not that it's an event, it good place to then go, and by the way, if you know, I've been talking about those other three books for the last couple months, you know, here's what's happening in the OG book, right?

01:04:56.447 --> 01:05:01.128
We got a storyline that's gonna blow up pretty big at about 375.

01:05:01.128 --> 01:05:04.849
Again, just to remind people that we're in the corner, hey, we're still here.

01:05:22.925 --> 01:05:24.025
Not really.

01:05:24.025 --> 01:05:27.706
I talk about sort of the hot thing that's coming down the pipeline.

01:05:27.706 --> 01:05:30.025
I've got cool books I'm quite proud of.

01:05:30.025 --> 01:05:40.326
know, again, we didn't do like 20 copies until the price, most of them at $2.99 when they first came out, just so that they were easy.

01:05:40.826 --> 01:05:52.826
But you know, some of the books like Sam and Twitch and The Curse of Shirley Johnson, and even a new one out, Blood Letter, and we've got like the Dark Ages coming out.

01:05:53.842 --> 01:06:16.757
I think cool, like everybody but and I don't expect everybody to sort of support all the book but I think if you have a curiosity you might want to sort of pick up one or two because it might be more of your cup of tea instead of a sort of straightforward superhero book maybe like spawn or something.

01:06:33.112 --> 01:06:38.141
Alright, Aaron, Chris, you guys be good and congrats to your five years in the industry too.