INTERVIEW: Jeff Lemire

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Hey, this is Jeff Lemire, the comic book creator behind titles like Sweet Tooth, Essex County, Black Hammer, Minor Arcana, and you are listening to the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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Welcome to the Oblivion Bar podcast with your host, Chris Hacker and Aaron Knowles.

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Hello everyone and welcome to episode 197 of the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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I am your solo host this week, Chris Hacker.

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Aaron Knowles is not with us this week.

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He is currently abroad doing other things and other stuff.

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So if you could just go over to at better actions TTV and just give him the middle finger emoji as many as you can fit into the message box for me.

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That would really be helpful because this week, big, big episode, you know, we say this quite a bit, maybe too much possibly.

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but I'm being totally honest here with everybody listening right now that this week on the show and having someone like Jeff Lemire on the podcast is an extremely big deal for me.

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uh Not only just, you know, again, for the oblivion bar, but as a comic book reader, when I think back to like, when I really started getting into comics the way that I am now, you know, I've been pretty vocal about how that Scott Snyder and Greg Capullo, Court of Owls run was extremely very prevalent.

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towards my extreme love of comics and becoming a Wednesday warrior and setting up a pull list and talking about comics online with people on Twitter back when that was a cool platform to be on.

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Jeff Lemire and his work, and I'm thinking very specifically of like Sweet Tooth and his Moon Knight run.

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I mean, even the Terrifics, when the new 52 first kicked off, or not 52, excuse me, when Rebirth first kicked off and they had a lot of those new, the new age of heroes, I forget what they're actually, what the name was called.

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You know, the Terrifics was sort of the big one.

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That was...

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Jeff Lemire on that book with sort of creating a DC version of Fantastic Four.

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I was so into it.

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And I think that just sort of speaks to a broader, sort of more appealing, you know, sentiment that Jeff Lemire has always just sort of, he's always just really struck me with his work.

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Everything that he's done, I found enjoyable on some level, whether he is the sole creator doing both writing and drawing, but also just as a writer, you know, I feel like Sweet Tooth is an easy one, but I would say like The Descender is also equally as incredible.

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There's also like Primordial and of course, Essex County, which we get into quite a bit here in this conversation.

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Gideon Falls, Phantom Road, which something crazily everybody, if you're listening to this and you know, you know, if you've been listening to the Bilibli bar for a long time, you know that back in 2023, I want to say through our partnership with what not, we actually got a variant cover.

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Like we were able to pick an artist and create a variant, like an actual variant that was sold in stores.

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And we picked Phantom Road number one.

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Of course, being a Jeff Lemire joint and we got Christian Ward, good friend of the show.

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to do that cover.

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And that's very purposeful.

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Like again, because of my uh affection for Jeff Lemire's work.

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But to continue on Black Hammer, Royal City, which he actually sort of talks about a little bit here.

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There's also Minor Arcana and that's not even getting into a lot of his big two work.

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know, speaking of Absolute Flash and JSA and his Robin and Batman story, the most recent one being, there was a previous first run and now there's a uh Jason Todd sort of spinoff to that as well.

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So we get into a lot of that, but I think sort of the central pillar of this conversation and I'll try not to be super long winded here in the intro, but.

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10,000 ink stains is.

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memoir that he's been working on for quite a while now, which is sort of a mixture of some of his essays from his sub stack tales from a farm, but also showing off some references and actual pages and even whole comics that have never been released before are in this 10,000 ink stains.

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And I had the pleasure of reading that early.

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I should also say big shout out to dark horse for not only sending that over, but also just getting us in contact with Jeff, because again, if you haven't heard, or if you, if you can't tell from my buttering up early on in this conversation, Jeff's one of my all time favorites.

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There's really no easy way to say it.

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I feel like I try to sort of treat every conversation the same and not put any extra pressure on myself or the creator.

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And I don't think that happens here, of course.

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I mean, everyone, you can let me know after listening to this if you think that I do that, but it's hard not to get sort of overly excited when you get a chance to talk to someone like Jeff Lemire.

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So very excited to share this conversation with everybody.

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You know, if you've been following Jeff's career long enough, you know that he is sort of a reserved guy, sort of quiet even.

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And I say it in this conversation and I stand by it.

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It's an extremely endearing trait to have to sort of expose your underbelly in this medium and comics.

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That's what it is.

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And if you again, read a lot of Jeff's work, you know that he's not really shy about sharing things that he's worried about or sort of digging up past traumas or anything like that.

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But when you're talking to him face to face and, I even felt this while talking to him here, he is a sort of a more quiet soul, right?

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Like He lets his work do this talking and I really appreciate that.

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And again, I find it really endearing.

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So I'll shut up about that now.

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I'll stop the preamble.

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I'm sure everyone that's clicked on this episode already wants to hear Jeff talk about 10,000 ink stains and some of the other stuff in his career.

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So very briefly, before we get into that, if you want to support the oblivion bar podcast, consider going over to our Patreon, patreon.com forward slash oblivion bar pod.

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It's the best way to support the show for your support over there on Patreon.

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You get access to the grid, which is Aaron and I sort of sandbox.

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We like to call it the oblivion bar after dark, where we sort of talk about everything that we wouldn't generally talk about here on the normal show.

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So you get a little bit of that.

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You also get early access to these episodes.

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So everyone listen to this right now.

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You could be listening to it early over on Patreon and you also get a Patreon polls.

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We'll also share our episode transcripts.

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So I like to overly prepare for these conversations with creators.

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You get access to all those questions and references that I'm reading off currently, actually, as I'm talking to you right now, this is something that sort of keeps me on track and definitely keeps Aaron on track, cause you know, he likes to go on his segues.

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So the episode transcript is pretty much like our living Bible that we use for every single episode.

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So once again, patreon.com forward slash oblivion bar pod, go check that out.

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You can also give it a shot a seven day free trial.

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And hopefully you find something that you enjoy.

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I know people really like the grid because again, it's just more of Aaron and I and our shenanigans.

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So go check that out enough preamble.

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Very excited to bring this conversation to you guys here.

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Again, go pick up 10,000 Inkstains.

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If you're listening to this before July 15th, which is when the book is released, make sure you guys call your LCS, get that thing pre-ordered.

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This is the kind of book that you wanna support.

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We need more of this.

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We need more Jeff Lemire's in the world.

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So without further ado, let's go ahead and get in this conversation with Jeff Lemire.

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This July, one of the greatest creator-owned comic series of all time begins a powerful new chapter.

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From Oni Press, return to the Eisner Award nominated world of The Sixth Gun, as creators Colin Bunn and Brian Hurt reunite for the Battle for the Sixth Number One, an extra-sized comic event told across three prestige format issues.

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In 1866, in the aftermath of the Civil War, a race to claim six objects of enormous occult power began.

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Thrusting the fate of humanity, into the hands of an ordinary young woman and a hard-nosed gunfighter.

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Together, they were the best hope to stop Armageddon.

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They prevailed, but at a terrible price.

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Three decades later, at the dawn of the 20th century, the sixth gun is about to be reborn anew, as it has been countless times across the centuries.

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This time, however, a brigade of familiar fighters is ready and waiting to challenge a secret cabal, one that hopes to use the gun's limitless power to incept a new century of war and suffering.

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The Six Gun Battle for the Six number one coming to comic shops everywhere on July 23rd only.

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from Oni Press.

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And now, this week's special guest.

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Joining us today is the Eisner Award winning New York Times bestseller behind titles like Sweet Tooth, Primordial, Exis County, Phantom Road, Black Hammer, Descender, Royal City, Gideon Falls, The Bone Orchard Mythos, Fish Flies, and Minor Arcana.

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That's just a couple of them.

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He has also recently returned to DC Comics with writing duties on JSA with artist Diego Ortega, Absolute Flash with artist Nick Robles, and Robin and Batman, Jason Todd with artist Dustin Yuen.

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He is here today to discuss his upcoming memoir over at Dark Horse Comics, 10,000 Ink Stains, which hits shelves on July 15th.

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It is my honor to welcome Jeff Lemire onto the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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Hey, thanks, Chris.

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Appreciate it.

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Jeff, what an honor it is to get you here today on the Oblivion Bar podcast.

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just an immediate deviation as soon as we hop here on camera, you as I was reading 10,000 Inkstains, I learned that you went to film school back in the day, which puts you in this very special category of some of my favorite guests to get here on the Oblivion Bar, which are comic creators who are also big film nerds.

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with how busy you are, you know, and how busy you have been here recently.

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Are you ever able to get to the movie theaters anymore?

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And if so, is there a recent movie that you've seen that you, you know, sort of sticks out or one that really stuck with you afterwards?

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Man, I wish I don't get to the movie theater as much as I used to between work and family, know I always there's always things I want to see but I never get there and end up watching them at home But in turn, yeah, I don't know.

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I haven't seen anything good lately.

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I gotta be honest.

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I'm looking forward to 28 years later.

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I want to see that Sure Yeah, I don't know that one's buzzing it.

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I wanna I want to see that for sure Yeah, I actually saw that last week and it's been sort of divisive.

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think among movie fans, people who enjoy cinema and I'm using like cinema in quotations, know, like people who, who enjoy the art form, I guess really seem to like it.

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And it's weird because everyone that I listened to and respect, you know, reviewers, people who again, write, write about film really love it.

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And I just couldn't connect with it.

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So I'm curious if and when you eventually get to it, whether it be again at the theater or at home, I'd love to.

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I'll ask you about it next time we're at a con together.

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I'll just see if you eventually solve 28 years later and see what your thoughts are.

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Yeah, I do love Alex Garland and Danny Boyle.

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yeah, I'm kind of the target audience, but we'll see.

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We'll see.

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They definitely do a lot of innovative things.

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I will say that like it's it's all boil and garland on screen Like they're trying a lot of things there make there, you know swing it.

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They're swinging really hard for the fences I'll tell you that and I think anyone can appreciate that and you know speaking of ten thousand ink stains Which is again sort of the central pillar of this conversation You know you mentioned in that there towards the beginning when we're in the early part of your you know Your life before you actually even get into comics you mentioned that you worked in a kitchen and you know As a fellow former service industry worker, I bartended for around 10 years.

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I still have a hard time properly explaining how much those late night cleaning slash venting slash drinking sessions really meant to me and still mean to me to this day.

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It's one of those like you had to be there kind of situation.

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So I'm curious, was that sort of your same relationship with the industry and.

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Yeah.

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And then like, you know, leading up to Essex County, this, this was your life again.

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to me, like it's sort of noodle on that idea on the restaurant industry before getting into comics.

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Yeah, I mean, was in film school here in Toronto and near the end of film school, I needed to get a job to help pay for things.

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And, you know, like with so many people in the service industry, restaurant industry is sort of an easy thing to get to get your foot in the door.

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You know, I started washing dishes and then moved to the kitchen.

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uh And then when I got out of school and I really wanted to focus on comics full time, it was really good because, you know, the shifts are flexible and so I could pretty much work.

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night shifts in the kitchen and then I could draw all day because I do like to draw like I'm much more a morning person when it comes to the creative stuff.

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So that really worked for me for a long time and I did that for I guess I did it for a decade too.

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You know, I was doing doing that at least at least a decade.

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ah And yeah, even when I started getting a little more serious about comics and having things published, you know, and top shelf published the Essex County books in.

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2005, 2006, I was still, you know, having to work in the kitchen because those books, well, they started to get some critical acclaim and sort of gave me a foothold into the comics industry.

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They still weren't really, you know, paying the rent, you know, it was a really small publisher.

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And so, yeah, I was still working in kitchens right up until almost Sweet Tooth in 2008, I guess.

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And I kind of just thought that would be my life.

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You know, I didn't think I'd make a living.

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doing comics, seemed really unrealistic.

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And so I just kind of thought, yeah, I would work in restaurants, I'll work as a cook, and then do comics as sort of my passion thing, you know?

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And I was and would have been probably happy doing that, you know?

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I'm glad that I can make a living doing comics and can focus more of my time on it, obviously now, but ah it was a good life, you know?

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There's a lot of camaraderie and...

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uh and stuff in the kitchen and a lot of great characters that you can pull from.

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yeah, I did.

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You know, it was a real sort of community that we had working in the kitchens, uh especially here in Toronto.

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I was working with a lot of musicians.

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You know, it was either artists or musicians who worked in kitchens.

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And I worked with a whole bunch of musicians who are kind of in the indie rock scene at the time.

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And it was a good time.

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really, yeah, I really enjoyed it.

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And it fed into my work quite a bit.

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You know, that's you're so right.

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Comradery is the sort of highlighted word in that all of that.

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It's there is a certain level of again, as I said, sort of in the question that you had to be there to sort of understand what it's like to be in that industry.

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And I feel like I'm currently wearing a St.

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Louis blues hat, which I'm sure we'll get into at some point with the hockey theme of it all.

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But when I lived in St.

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Louis and going to college myself, I bartended my way through college and I miss it.

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Like I was just talking to my partner the other day about She asked me, she's like, would you ever want to go back and bartend again?

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And, or do you miss it even?

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And I was like, I miss it every day.

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But, and this sort of leads into a question.

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This isn't me just noodling on my own ideas, but I found it hard, right?

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To separate from the industry eventually.

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And I'm curious when you were eventually finding success with Essex County and with Sweet Tooth and even Lost Dogs as well, was there a hard disconnect for you too?

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Were you able to sort of just hack it off and be done?

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Or did you find yourself wanting to go back?

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For me, it was a gradual thing.

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I think I was ready.

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was at a different point in my life where I was pushing 30 and I got married.

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so it was like a transitional period.

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And I didn't just quit all at once.

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I went from working full time in kitchens to the, I was able to work maybe three shifts a week.

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And then I went down to, I was just working one shift a week.

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then finally, so there was a, I didn't go cold.

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yeah, weaning off of that lifestyle.

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um the more that kind of that the comics started to take off and the more money I was making with comics, the less shifts I was able to take.

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it kind of like, yeah, it's sort of one slowly fed into the other.

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Sure.

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Do you ever have any ambition to move to the front of the house?

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Did you always just want to be a cook or did you ever want to bartender?

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I like the kitchen.

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actually, the restaurant I worked at was an open kitchen though, that was actually in the front of the house.

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was a really, yeah, we were in front of the, we were like the first thing you saw when you came in.

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So yeah, I kind of always, it's like you're on a stage doing, fricking burritos or whatever.

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Wow, that's an interesting concept.

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I don't think we have much of that here in this Yeah, it was a weird, was a cool, weird little place I worked at for like eight or nine years here in Toronto.

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was like an ex, all these ex punk rock guys started it as just like a taco takeout thing.

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And it kind of grew into a kitchen.

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And I think that's why there were always so many musicians working there too.

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It kind of had this, this sort of legacy of, of musicians in the area kind of giving each other work and stuff.

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it was, yeah, it was a cool place.

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And you go over that quite a bit towards the beginning of this memoir that we're going to be talking about today.

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And I say we just get into it here with 10,000 Inkstains.

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And you mentioned in the intro that you're a pretty private person.

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think anyone who's been following your career or has met you in person at a con, you can sort of feel that with you.

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You are the Jeff Lemire that you hear right now, everybody.

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That's the one you meet at cons.

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And that's not a knock at all.

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I think it's really endearing actually.

00:16:53.464 --> 00:17:10.500
And that actually makes this memoir, 10,000 Inkstains, as a longtime fan of yours, all the more important and everyone that I've talked to about this upcoming, you know, memoir that I've had the honor of reading early, they're very excited about it because this is a part of you that a lot of people haven't been able to really see in depth.

00:17:10.500 --> 00:17:22.380
And you know, you've said, and I'm sort of elaborating here on this is that it's a way of reevaluating, you know, this story, 25 year career you've had in comics, but also an exercise in processing your life up to this point.

00:17:22.380 --> 00:17:28.182
You know, you mentioned that you're, you're brinking on 50 and this is the time to sort of look back on all of that and you do an excellent job.

00:17:28.182 --> 00:17:38.028
of laying out what your life has been before and even during the creation of some of your most accomplished works, Essex County, Sweet Tooth, Black Hammer, along a lot of the things that we've already talked about thus far.

00:17:38.028 --> 00:17:48.433
So, you know, did your relationship change with any particular segment or even a specific moment of your life while working on this project and sort of reflecting on Yeah, I think it did.

00:17:48.433 --> 00:17:50.875
It was an interesting process.

00:17:50.973 --> 00:17:58.000
It kind of coincided with a lot of other sort of big moments in my life, know, so it all got mixed together too.

00:17:58.000 --> 00:18:07.365
was, uh I guess it was like coming out of COVID, which kind of shifted everyone's perspective on their lives, I think to some degree, you know, I was, so there was that.

00:18:07.365 --> 00:18:13.708
then um I went out from COVID, I went right into show running the Essex County TV show here in Canada.

00:18:13.708 --> 00:18:28.031
that, I mean, comics really, To say comics for my life was sort of, you know, I really from 2002, 2003 onward, I draw every day, you know, for eight hours or whatever.

00:18:28.031 --> 00:18:31.173
It's like such a routine, you know, and it really, I love that routine.

00:18:31.173 --> 00:18:32.804
It's very healthy for me.

00:18:32.844 --> 00:18:43.488
But when I did the TV show, I was suddenly away from comics for a year and on set and working with a very social kind of collaborative process of filmmaking.

00:18:43.488 --> 00:19:01.198
And it was so different from what I had been used to for the last 20 That was a big shift, you where I had this extended break and got, I think I got some perspective because when you stop and kind of, you kind of come to appreciate comics even more, you know, when you kind of lose it for a little bit.

00:19:01.198 --> 00:19:05.382
And I found that that whole process of show writing was very stressful.

00:19:05.382 --> 00:19:10.384
was, it's an extremely stressful gig to do.

00:19:10.705 --> 00:19:14.128
you put that on top of sort of being out of my routine of making comics and stuff.

00:19:14.128 --> 00:19:15.450
So I think I had this.

00:19:15.852 --> 00:19:23.428
All that stuff was going on as I worked on this book and I just sort of, yeah, I think it was really good to kind of, I don't often look back on work.

00:19:23.428 --> 00:19:32.153
I'm always, always working on the next thing and you know, I'm like right onto the next page or next project and I don't really, I just kind of put stuff in a drawer and don't even look at it.

00:19:32.153 --> 00:19:35.498
I've never reread any of my work or anything like that.

00:19:35.498 --> 00:19:42.363
So going back and kind of going through each sort of stage of my development and career was really interesting.

00:19:42.363 --> 00:19:58.709
And I don't know if your question was, I, I guess, Yeah, I had a I think I have a real appreciation for the early days of how free it was, ah especially before I started making a living doing it when you're just sort of when I was working at restaurants and drawing Essex County and stuff.

00:19:58.709 --> 00:20:06.733
It was just complete freedom because you didn't have anything to lose, you know, and I didn't really expect to make those books to really even be published or anything.

00:20:06.733 --> 00:20:09.385
I was just creating and living my life.

00:20:09.385 --> 00:20:13.097
And that's sort of like a once in a you only get to your first books once.

00:20:13.097 --> 00:20:13.887
Right.

00:20:13.965 --> 00:20:32.965
So looking back on that, that was a really kind of cool and I have a new appreciation for it, know, and yeah, I mean, and then you kind of looking at all the different stages and kind of thinking about where you were, gives you, even for me, it kind of gives us some context, know, like even the mistakes I made or the things I did that I weren't, I wasn't as happy with the end results.

00:20:32.965 --> 00:20:43.942
You can kind of look at what was going on and see why almost, you know, and then it kind of makes you more aware of decisions you make now, cause you kind of thought of all these things and they have been through and.

00:20:44.046 --> 00:20:46.625
and decisions you've made and work you've done.

00:20:46.625 --> 00:20:50.413
And it can all kind of helps to inform what you want to do next for sure.

00:20:50.413 --> 00:20:51.253
Yeah, it's interesting, right?

00:20:51.253 --> 00:20:59.438
Like the mistakes you make throughout your life, they think in the moment, but a lot of times they just better prepare you for how to react to those kinds of situations later on.

00:20:59.438 --> 00:21:00.438
Yeah.

00:21:01.878 --> 00:21:03.759
You know, or that, right?

00:21:03.759 --> 00:21:04.460
Yeah.

00:21:04.460 --> 00:21:18.422
And you even talk about it a little bit in 10,000 ink stains about how I was it Essex County, perhaps I'm forgetting the actual title that you're talking about, but you mentioned how like the process of having obviously getting paid.

00:21:18.422 --> 00:21:22.650
money is great for working on comics, but there was that deadline.

00:21:22.650 --> 00:21:29.836
The deadline was like this sort of a very abrasive reaction that you weren't prepared for, I don't think in that time in your life.

00:21:29.836 --> 00:21:38.219
I think you're talking about what I did to nobody because that was that was the first sort of real paying job for DC before Sweet Tooth and which was great.

00:21:38.219 --> 00:21:42.851
I got to finally quit the restaurant completely and just work on comics all day, which was awesome.

00:21:42.851 --> 00:21:51.994
But it was the first time it wasn't even so much a deadline as a page count, you know, because when I did Essex County and other projects before that, I was just doing it for myself.

00:21:51.994 --> 00:21:56.366
So I just kind of if a scene wanted to be 10 pages, I just drew 10 pages.

00:21:56.366 --> 00:22:00.953
You know, you didn't have to really think about how many, you know, any sort of a restriction.

00:22:01.114 --> 00:22:05.554
The nobody was the first, it was definitely 144 pages that I had to tell the story, right?

00:22:05.554 --> 00:22:09.874
So you had to really start to condense my storytelling a little bit.

00:22:09.874 --> 00:22:14.054
And I had to learn how to do that in ways that didn't change my storytelling.

00:22:14.054 --> 00:22:16.493
So yeah, it was a bit of a learning curve on that project.

00:22:16.493 --> 00:22:21.493
But by the time I'd finished that, then I went on to Sweet Tooth pretty much right away.

00:22:21.493 --> 00:22:28.554
And then you're doing 20 page issues and that the page count and sort of that structure actually became quite fun to work with.

00:22:28.555 --> 00:22:31.412
At the beginning, did feel a little bit restrictive for sure.

00:22:31.458 --> 00:22:32.218
Yeah.

00:22:32.218 --> 00:22:37.461
Now we've had the great fortune of talking to a couple of different creators who have, you know, dabbled in Hollywood.

00:22:37.461 --> 00:22:42.933
You know, we had Matt Fraction on recently when he was working on Godzilla and then obviously you with Sweet Tooth.

00:22:42.933 --> 00:22:46.761
then I was just sp- I just had another one in my head.

00:22:46.761 --> 00:22:47.126
I'm sorry.

00:22:47.126 --> 00:22:55.211
Jeff Johns was someone else that we've spoken to semi recently who had a moment while working on a television series or a film.

00:22:55.211 --> 00:23:01.273
And it's funny, you saying that you sort of grew a uh greater appreciation for the comic medium.

00:23:01.346 --> 00:23:04.669
They've all said that they all like we stepped away for a bit.

00:23:04.669 --> 00:23:08.105
We did the TV thing and now we're so excited to be back in comics.

00:23:08.105 --> 00:23:26.508
And I'm just curious like different muscle that you earn from working in TV and film that you don't get in comics that you sort of miss now that you're you're back fully in comics or are you just happy to be back working in comics and doing again as we spoke about earlier your six to eight titles that you're working on at once.

00:23:26.508 --> 00:23:30.738
I mean, there are things about working in film and TV that I really enjoyed.

00:23:30.738 --> 00:23:33.303
I like the social aspect.

00:23:33.337 --> 00:23:38.729
Doing comics is so solitary, which obviously you have to mostly enjoy that or else you wouldn't do it.

00:23:38.729 --> 00:23:46.976
And I do enjoy mostly working alone every day, but it was kind of cool just to be with people all day.

00:23:46.976 --> 00:23:52.480
Since working in restaurants, I hadn't really had that sort of a social kind of work environment.

00:23:52.480 --> 00:23:54.280
So I missed that a little bit.

00:23:54.476 --> 00:24:03.510
You do collaborate in comics, but it's not the same because you're kind of both often in different countries, in different parts of the world and just doing your sections of the work alone.

00:24:03.631 --> 00:24:06.282
I think I did kind of enjoy the social thing.

00:24:06.282 --> 00:24:19.390
yeah, I mean, other than that, in terms of the creative stuff, comics for me is still such a superior medium because there's just so much more freedom to kind of have a vision and see it through.

00:24:19.390 --> 00:24:23.501
And there's an immediacy to it where you can.

00:24:23.627 --> 00:24:27.569
You know, I'm drawing pages today that will be in readers' hands in a couple of months.

00:24:27.569 --> 00:24:35.634
You know, it's so quick and direct, you know, and that's, there's not a lot of art forms that really are that sort of immediate.

00:24:35.634 --> 00:24:38.546
And so it's hard to beat really.

00:24:38.935 --> 00:24:39.685
Sure.

00:24:39.685 --> 00:24:45.009
Now something I've heard from folks who have worked on memoirs before, you know, this is a story about you.

00:24:45.009 --> 00:24:47.519
Like that's a, that's a very personal project.

00:24:47.519 --> 00:24:58.914
And I found that some people have that hard time balancing, you know, facts and then like mixing an emotion into that project and maybe even slightly becoming a little bit of an unreliable narrator in certain aspects.

00:24:58.914 --> 00:25:03.457
Did you find that at all while you're working on this project or did you have a pretty decent time of separating?

00:25:03.457 --> 00:25:04.386
This is what happened.

00:25:04.386 --> 00:25:07.241
Here's how I felt, but this is what happened kind of deal.

00:25:07.241 --> 00:25:08.202
Yeah, no, I didn't.

00:25:08.202 --> 00:25:10.923
I didn't never really had a problem with that.

00:25:10.923 --> 00:25:17.248
I don't think, you know, the essays that I wrote for this, I wrote them sort of just really stream of consciousness.

00:25:17.248 --> 00:25:23.351
Like I didn't I mean, I obviously edited them later, but as I was writing them, I just didn't I just didn't overthink it.

00:25:23.351 --> 00:25:28.314
I kind of just yeah, stream of consciousness, really just thinking about everything that was going on.

00:25:28.541 --> 00:25:33.116
You know, and you know, it is like you start thinking about one memory and it triggers others right away.

00:25:33.116 --> 00:25:37.093
So it's a bit of a cascade like You start thinking back to what was going on.

00:25:37.093 --> 00:25:42.382
You're doing whatever project and then all these other little memories start kind of attaching to it.

00:25:42.382 --> 00:25:53.105
And so I just let it kind of flow out and I didn't worry too much, you And then later you obviously go through it and clean things up and take some things out that you don't want.

00:25:53.886 --> 00:25:55.868
You're like, wait, a lot of people are going to read this.

00:25:55.868 --> 00:25:57.529
I should probably take that out of here.

00:25:58.332 --> 00:26:07.260
Did you find yourself reaching out to folks from, you know, your previous lives, like any deadly snake reach, you know, do you call it to any of those guys from back in the day?

00:26:07.778 --> 00:26:08.741
I mean, I'm in touch.

00:26:08.741 --> 00:26:12.772
I think most of the people in the book are still in regular contact with most of them.

00:26:12.772 --> 00:26:16.362
So yeah, no, didn't really, there was no really reaching out to anyone.

00:26:16.526 --> 00:26:34.506
I always like there are times where I'll play a game or I'll watch a movie or hear a song even or go to a certain place because I don't live in my hometown anymore and I rarely visit it and I find myself getting a little swept up in the nostalgia of it all and I want to like reach out and be like, hey, how are you?

00:26:34.506 --> 00:26:43.758
I haven't talked to you, you know, in 10 plus years and I was just curious, you know, with a project like this, just if any of that was something that sort of sparked within you at all, you know.

00:26:43.758 --> 00:26:44.698
Yeah, not really.

00:26:44.698 --> 00:26:51.038
mean, I think I'm still friends with most of the people, especially in the comics industry that I was back when I started.

00:26:51.417 --> 00:26:55.251
And so, yeah, yeah, I didn't really have to do that.

00:26:55.251 --> 00:27:13.290
You know, speaking of sort of a bit of a collaborator effort, a collaboration effort that you had here with this book is that the book credits Daniel Chabon and Greg Lockhart and Eric Harburn as the editors of this project with some designer help from Courtney Minard over from, this is sort of a mixture of Dark Horse and Tiny Onion.

00:27:14.051 --> 00:27:28.971
now that this, you know, this is not meant to siphon off any credit from them and their work on this book, but reading 10,000 Inkstains and being a longtime fan of yours, this felt extremely personal and just, know, very Jeff Lemire.

00:27:28.971 --> 00:27:34.739
If you've read one of your books, a lot of them, they have a very similar tone and a tone that I absolutely love.

00:27:34.739 --> 00:27:43.700
And this might be a big question for you, Jeff, but what would you like for people to take away from reading a memoir like this and learning about your journey?

00:27:43.847 --> 00:28:02.746
I kind of hope it sort of demystifies the creative process a little because, know, when I was younger and I wanted to make comics, I also have to keep in mind that when I wanted to make comics back in the late 90s, it was a different world, you know, where we didn't have the access to creators that people have now through social media.

00:28:02.885 --> 00:28:12.309
But nonetheless, I still think just seeing people's creative process and kind of things people struggle with while they're working on stuff that, you know.

00:28:12.789 --> 00:28:17.674
sort of didn't demystify like anyone can do it, you know, it's not, it's not magic.

00:28:17.674 --> 00:28:22.199
You know, it's just hard work really, like any you.

00:28:22.200 --> 00:28:31.878
And I think especially, you know, I kind of opened up a little bit about sort of some of my struggles, especially when I was younger with uh depression and anxiety and stuff.

00:28:31.878 --> 00:28:36.758
And, you know, I just thinking back to when I was really going through that in my.

00:28:36.758 --> 00:28:42.330
early 20s and stuff and I really wanted to make comics and I was struggling and I was not a super happy person.

00:28:42.330 --> 00:28:46.163
And I still think there's a lot of stigma around mental health stuff.

00:28:46.163 --> 00:28:56.808
if some creator whose work I admired had come out and talked openly about that, it would have made me feel so much more comfortable with myself and okay about it.

00:28:56.808 --> 00:29:03.472
it would have made me feel like I can still, like you can still live a life and you can still make things and do art and accomplish stuff.

00:29:03.472 --> 00:29:06.178
It's not, you don't have to give up, know.

00:29:06.178 --> 00:29:11.779
So I guess just, I felt like if I could put some of that out there, that it's a good thing.

00:29:11.950 --> 00:29:12.869
Yeah, I love that.

00:29:12.869 --> 00:29:15.529
And I think that definitely comes across while reading this.

00:29:15.549 --> 00:29:18.410
you know, I'm about, I would say three fourths of the way through.

00:29:18.410 --> 00:29:21.890
haven't gotten, I haven't gotten to like the minor arcana part of the book yet.

00:29:21.890 --> 00:29:25.182
Cause you, you pretty much go up to like present day, which is really impressive.

00:29:25.182 --> 00:29:30.301
was writing it right up until, yeah, 2000, a year ago or whatever.

00:29:30.301 --> 00:29:31.077
So yeah.

00:29:31.077 --> 00:29:31.598
Yeah.

00:29:31.598 --> 00:29:34.622
And you include, which I think is really cool.

00:29:34.622 --> 00:29:43.213
There's a lot of talk at the beginning of 10,000 Inkstains about ashtray, which is sort of like, is it fair to say this is like your first major piece of work?

00:29:43.213 --> 00:29:59.094
I know of its major, but it was my first sort of published mini zine comic, you know, that I put out into the world, even in this in any way, you know, up until then, I was drawing comics all the time, but I hadn't tried to publish anything or sort of put it out, you know.

00:29:59.272 --> 00:30:01.153
And Astray was sort of the first thing.

00:30:01.153 --> 00:30:10.894
This was 2002, 2003, where I felt like I wanted to at least try to start putting stuff out there, good or bad and sort of.

00:30:10.894 --> 00:30:13.653
get some feedback and kind of or whatever.

00:30:14.013 --> 00:30:17.354
And so, yeah, that was my very first sort of zine mini comic that I made.

00:30:17.354 --> 00:30:24.574
I think I printed up like 100 copies or 300 copies or something and just distributed them locally.

00:30:24.574 --> 00:30:26.314
You know, this is again before the Internet.

00:30:26.314 --> 00:30:27.614
couldn't just post stuff.

00:30:27.614 --> 00:30:33.013
So it was like doing zine shows and putting them on commission at comic shops around town and stuff.

00:30:33.013 --> 00:30:33.741
Yeah.

00:30:33.741 --> 00:30:34.637
Mm.

00:30:34.637 --> 00:30:34.958
Yeah.

00:30:34.958 --> 00:30:44.238
And I think that's, uh, it's kind of poetic that the end of 10,000 eke stains is the first issue of, of astray or at least, uh, you know, what you had finished up to that point.

00:30:44.238 --> 00:30:46.597
And I'm, curious, even in the beginning, right.

00:30:46.597 --> 00:30:50.097
You sort of prompt people before they get into it, that it's slightly revised.

00:30:50.097 --> 00:30:55.377
And I'm, was just curious, like, when you say slightly revised, uh, what were you able to add to this?

00:30:55.377 --> 00:30:59.289
You know, Oh yeah, no, it's I'm not sure what it says.

00:30:59.289 --> 00:31:01.615
But yeah, it's not it's not revised in any way.

00:31:01.615 --> 00:31:04.512
It's just it's put out exactly as it as it was.

00:31:04.512 --> 00:31:05.564
uh Sure.

00:31:05.564 --> 00:31:06.213
Okay.

00:31:06.213 --> 00:31:06.644
I'm trying.

00:31:06.644 --> 00:31:08.895
I'm trying to look really quick to see what it says here.

00:31:08.977 --> 00:31:11.798
I've reprinted and shared a full ashtray number one.

00:31:11.798 --> 00:31:14.832
uh I read it incorrectly.

00:31:14.832 --> 00:31:19.865
It says on a, what follows is a faithful unrevised reproduction of the original mini comic.

00:31:19.865 --> 00:31:20.646
I apologize.

00:31:20.646 --> 00:31:23.818
I thought, don't know why I thought it said revised, but that's, that's great.

00:31:23.818 --> 00:31:24.388
Then perfect.

00:31:24.388 --> 00:31:27.131
is directly version.

00:31:28.232 --> 00:31:29.113
Yeah, I love that.

00:31:29.113 --> 00:31:32.986
That's and it's again, it's, it feels very poetic that you sort of in 10,000 ink stains with that.

00:31:32.986 --> 00:31:35.084
And it's still so Jeff Lemire.

00:31:35.084 --> 00:31:36.517
Like we're going through it.

00:31:36.517 --> 00:31:41.230
Like it is still very much you, even though I'm sure you probably are even slightly embarrassed looking at it in today's.

00:31:41.230 --> 00:31:41.930
I'm embarrassed.

00:31:41.930 --> 00:31:45.462
I mean, it's obviously really, really early work and pretty crude.

00:31:45.462 --> 00:31:57.991
yeah, I mean, I think the reason I was I started putting it out even back then was I started to feel some sort of uh a foothold into, I don't know, getting a voice or telling stories a certain way that I felt comfortable with.

00:31:57.991 --> 00:32:07.887
So, I guess putting it at the end of the book like that was sort of, you know, it's like a full circle thing where like your earliest stuff, you know, you're still I'm still connected to it in some ways.

00:32:07.887 --> 00:32:10.410
And you can see the line from that to.

00:32:10.670 --> 00:32:15.501
my newest work, you know, I think you can still see the same creator there.

00:32:15.501 --> 00:32:16.301
Sure.

00:32:16.323 --> 00:32:17.182
agree.

00:32:17.182 --> 00:32:24.868
And, you know, speaking of your latest work, I'd to sort of noodle on Minor Arcana for a quick moment if I can, because I absolutely love it.

00:32:24.868 --> 00:32:30.211
You know, we're, think into, is it issue seven just came out this past week.

00:32:30.211 --> 00:32:35.266
If I'm thinking of that correctly here, that actually was recently nominated for an Eisner for best new series.

00:32:35.266 --> 00:32:36.366
So congratulations on that.

00:32:36.366 --> 00:32:37.676
That's incredible.

00:32:37.758 --> 00:32:44.334
And you you said on your, your sub stack here recently, Tales from the Farm, that this was a dream project.

00:32:44.334 --> 00:32:55.733
And I think that term gets thrown around sometimes by creators and I'm just curious, what was it about working on Taro and Teresa's story that made this a quote unquote dream project for you?

00:32:55.733 --> 00:32:58.134
It's not even so much the content of the book.

00:32:58.134 --> 00:33:03.228
Like, it's not even that it's not really what the book is about that makes it a dream project.

00:33:03.228 --> 00:33:08.070
It's just the freedom that I have to kind of tell a long form story again.

00:33:08.070 --> 00:33:11.542
You know, I haven't done that since I did Sweet Tooth, obviously.

00:33:11.542 --> 00:33:23.470
And then I tried to do it with Royal City, but I kind of crashed and burned halfway through that book, you know, and and then coming out of working on television to and say and kind of just thinking to myself, well, what if I could?

00:33:23.662 --> 00:33:29.301
make my own TV show, but with complete creative freedom and go wherever I want with it.

00:33:29.301 --> 00:33:33.082
just, you know, it kind of almost feels like that to me where I get to do.

00:33:33.142 --> 00:33:39.402
This is my like real shot at doing a really long, long form story with an ensemble cast.

00:33:39.521 --> 00:33:46.102
And it's not even so much the supernatural aspects of the tarot and all that stuff, which is really fun stuff.

00:33:46.102 --> 00:33:53.536
And it certainly provides a framework for the book, but it's just the characters themselves and spending time with them.

00:33:53.536 --> 00:33:57.627
month after month, you know, things start to evolve and take on a life of their own.

00:33:57.627 --> 00:33:58.348
They really do.

00:33:58.348 --> 00:33:59.990
I had forgotten that that happens.

00:33:59.990 --> 00:34:15.677
You know, it happened with Sweet Tooth and it's starting to happen with this book where when you're working on something like this for a long time and you just, you have that time and space to sort of keep thinking about the characters and, even not thinking about them, just let your subconscious work on them.

00:34:15.677 --> 00:34:28.724
New ideas come to you that you never expected a new whole new story avenues open up, you know, and ah It's really kind of a magical thing when that happens where you have some little inkling of an idea for a character at the beginning.

00:34:28.724 --> 00:34:33.989
And then when you get by the time you get to doing that storyline, it's evolved into something so much bigger.

00:34:34.070 --> 00:34:43.452
so I just, yeah, I'm really enjoying that process of sort of letting the story grow and unfold at its own pace and sort of take on a life of its own.

00:34:43.452 --> 00:34:51.119
And even in that sub stack, you mentioned that you want to have at some point, was it uh four dedicated deluxe hardcovers?

00:34:51.119 --> 00:34:54.123
So we're talking long form, long form story here.

00:34:54.123 --> 00:34:58.375
that was the idea from the beginning would be that there's four suites in the tarot deck.

00:34:58.375 --> 00:35:07.318
to have eventually if it's collected in deluxe art cover to have the four books representing the four suites, you know, um we thought that would be a cool way to collect it.

00:35:07.418 --> 00:35:12.110
But again, you I you saw us have to let the story kind of unfold at its own pace.

00:35:12.110 --> 00:35:18.291
And if it works out in a way that that fits perfectly great, but if not, well, we'll revise the plan.

00:35:18.291 --> 00:35:20.110
But yeah, it seems like it could work.

00:35:20.110 --> 00:35:20.670
Sure.

00:35:20.670 --> 00:35:24.039
Did I see somewhere that we're getting a change of colorist?

00:35:24.039 --> 00:35:27.981
Are you taking over as colorist at some point or am I see, did I see that incorrectly?

00:35:27.981 --> 00:35:29.262
It gets the other way around.

00:35:29.262 --> 00:35:32.702
I started off painting the book myself.

00:35:33.902 --> 00:35:39.181
And much like when I was doing that on Royal City by about issue five, I was burning out already.

00:35:39.181 --> 00:35:45.722
It's just such such a so much work, you know, and then we brought on a guest artist for a couple of issues to help me out.

00:35:45.722 --> 00:36:00.326
Leticia Cardinici and and a colorist named Patricio Del Pesce came on to color Leticia and he tried to sort of emulate my watercolor palette and stuff so that her artwork kind of felt cohesive with mine.

00:36:00.326 --> 00:36:06.840
And when I saw how he could do that, it kind of opened the door for him to start coloring my stuff.

00:36:07.221 --> 00:36:12.574
from issues, I think I did up to issue six and then Lutizia does seven, eight, nine.

00:36:12.574 --> 00:36:16.286
And so from issue 10 onward, I'll be drawing it, but he'll be coloring it.

00:36:16.286 --> 00:36:20.360
And it's a huge help in not burning me out for sure.

00:36:20.652 --> 00:36:26.445
That was going to be my next question was how much of a workload is that lifted off of your shoulders when it comes to surprisingly.

00:36:26.485 --> 00:36:30.686
And I still get to dabble with the coloring because I still paint the covers myself.

00:36:30.686 --> 00:36:38.425
And then there's certain little sections within the book where I'll do the color, but it's just enough that it takes that extra workload off.

00:36:38.425 --> 00:36:41.045
It probably cuts the workload almost in half.

00:36:41.166 --> 00:36:41.865
Sure.

00:36:41.865 --> 00:36:50.425
What was, know, again, gosh, I don't mean to butter you up too much, Jeff here, but you know, your career has been, it's been a very successful one.

00:36:50.425 --> 00:37:02.626
I will say as, as again, as a, as a long time fan and with this new Eisner nom, how do you react to that now in 2025 with this new book with mine or Kana when you hear that you're, know, you're, you're up for another Eisner.

00:37:02.626 --> 00:37:03.565
What was your first reaction?

00:37:03.565 --> 00:37:04.146
I'm just curious.

00:37:04.146 --> 00:37:06.199
Like, how did you react to that news?

00:37:06.199 --> 00:37:07.639
Well, you know, I've been lucky.

00:37:07.639 --> 00:37:14.393
I've been nominated for a lot of Eisner's, know, and I think first of all, it's you put so much into yourself like I do with Minoracana.

00:37:14.393 --> 00:37:20.927
It's when those personal projects and I, especially that ones I'm drawing myself, when they get recognized, it's always even more special for sure.

00:37:20.927 --> 00:37:26.771
Cause it's kind of a validation and some, even now that, you know, people are digging what you're doing.

00:37:26.771 --> 00:37:38.586
And, um, and that's always nice, but I think more than anything, it's just, it's really gratifying that, you know, I was nominated for Essex County back in 2006 or whatever, know, when it first came out.

00:37:38.586 --> 00:37:42.347
So 20 years later, pretty much, I'm still being nominated for new work.

00:37:42.347 --> 00:37:49.791
Like that's more than anything that I'm still doing stuff that people are responding to this far into my career is really what it's about.

00:37:49.791 --> 00:37:54.532
And that makes you feel great, you know, and more than the individual sort of nomination itself.

00:37:54.731 --> 00:38:00.333
It just kind of, it's gratifying knowing you're still connecting with people and yeah.

00:38:00.333 --> 00:38:01.855
Yeah, it's really refreshing to hear you say that.

00:38:01.855 --> 00:38:04.175
We recently spoke with Christopher Priest.

00:38:04.175 --> 00:38:06.193
You know, he's been in the industry for a very long time.

00:38:06.193 --> 00:38:18.324
We sort of talked about this idea of how, like, you know, being a comic creator in this medium for, you know, however long you decide you want to tell stories, it's not guaranteed that the longer you're in the medium, you're going to continue to connect with folks.

00:38:18.324 --> 00:38:18.963
Yeah.

00:38:18.963 --> 00:38:26.788
You know, and the ones that do like yourself and like Christopher, I think it's extremely impressive, you know, that you guys were able to continue on.

00:38:26.788 --> 00:38:35.949
And I will say it's also really refreshing to hear you say that this stuff still mean something to you, because I think it's really easy for some creators to go, ah, you know, it's not a big deal.

00:38:35.949 --> 00:38:37.210
The Eisner's.

00:38:39.190 --> 00:38:40.110
They're lying.

00:38:40.110 --> 00:38:40.429
Nice.

00:38:40.429 --> 00:38:40.699
Come on.

00:38:40.699 --> 00:38:41.811
Who's kidding you?

00:38:41.811 --> 00:38:48.393
Any walk of life, it's always nice to be recognized and to just for someone to like, you know, say you're doing a good job.

00:38:48.393 --> 00:38:49.764
I don't care what you've accomplished.

00:38:49.764 --> 00:38:50.474
It's always nice.

00:38:50.474 --> 00:38:51.275
Everyone loves it.

00:38:51.275 --> 00:38:52.704
You know, it's great.

00:38:52.704 --> 00:38:55.576
And it's great to be part of the industry of so many talented people.

00:38:55.576 --> 00:39:00.983
And you see your book nominated with the other best new series nominations.

00:39:00.983 --> 00:39:04.690
You're all such incredible books like on any year on their own could win it.

00:39:04.690 --> 00:39:13.748
You know, and it's like it's great to be in that company and be recognized as the you know, amongst such talented people, you know, it's very nice.

00:39:13.902 --> 00:39:14.461
Absolutely.

00:39:14.461 --> 00:39:18.742
And so does this mean that you're going to be at San Diego here in a couple of Yeah.

00:39:18.742 --> 00:39:19.681
Good deal.

00:39:19.742 --> 00:39:23.101
I always love that because I went to last year was my first Eisner.

00:39:23.101 --> 00:39:27.342
So we're recording this in 2025, 2024 first Eisner's ever.

00:39:27.342 --> 00:39:29.021
And I I'll be honest with you, Jeff.

00:39:29.021 --> 00:39:35.942
I honestly felt a little disheartened by just how many folks weren't there to accept their award.

00:39:35.992 --> 00:39:38.494
There is a bit of, you know, part of me gets it.

00:39:38.494 --> 00:39:43.438
It's too, because I mean, I like, I like being there even when I know I'm not going to win.

00:39:43.438 --> 00:39:45.449
Cause I do kind of just like, I like them.

00:39:45.449 --> 00:39:53.054
I kind there's something about being part of that bigger industry and that legacy of creators that I find really still exciting, you know, cool.

00:39:53.054 --> 00:39:56.016
ah Maybe I'm sappy and sentimental, but I just do.

00:39:56.016 --> 00:40:00.860
And, but I also know that when you, when you're, there is a stress that comes with it.

00:40:00.860 --> 00:40:07.309
Like, what if I sit through the whole thing and I It's like, it's kind of, it can rip your heart out a little bit sometimes, especially when you're there.

00:40:07.309 --> 00:40:11.043
So I do know that it's almost like a, for some people, I think it's a defense mechanism.

00:40:11.043 --> 00:40:14.974
Like if they're not there, it's not as bad when they don't win it, you know?

00:40:14.974 --> 00:40:16.815
But I don't know, you can't think that way.

00:40:16.815 --> 00:40:22.030
Like, you know, it's just, I think it's cool to be there and be a part of the whole thing.

00:40:22.030 --> 00:40:22.440
Absolutely.

00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:22.650
Yeah.

00:40:22.650 --> 00:40:23.771
It was really cool to see.

00:40:23.771 --> 00:40:28.534
mean, again, even with a lot of people not being there to accept, I still think it was an incredible experience.

00:40:28.534 --> 00:40:31.737
And not to mention you have a hotel con afterwards.

00:40:31.737 --> 00:40:38.429
Everyone hangs out at the Hilton hotel, that little triage of hotels and people drink.

00:40:38.429 --> 00:40:38.757
don't know.

00:40:38.757 --> 00:40:41.454
Did you ever do anything like that after something like the Eisners?

00:40:41.454 --> 00:40:43.094
I used to.

00:40:43.094 --> 00:40:44.634
I don't anymore.

00:40:44.753 --> 00:40:52.619
know, when I was 15 years ago, you would have found me at all the bar cons, but the last 10 years or so, not so much.

00:40:52.619 --> 00:40:53.376
Sure.

00:40:53.376 --> 00:40:54.422
Yeah, I get that.

00:40:54.422 --> 00:40:58.686
old and I bring my family with me now and yeah, it's just a different lifestyle.

00:40:58.829 --> 00:40:59.570
Sure.

00:40:59.570 --> 00:41:06.489
Well, I will say just to sort of deviate a little bit and for those keeping track at home, this is just workload today.

00:41:06.489 --> 00:41:06.829
Okay.

00:41:06.829 --> 00:41:15.048
So we have minor Arcana, JSA, Black Hammer, Spiral City, Phantom Road, Robin and Batman, Jason Todd, Absolute Flash.

00:41:15.048 --> 00:41:20.750
These are all monthly books in 2025 at some point, whether it is right now or at some point in 2025.

00:41:20.750 --> 00:41:26.949
I've heard rumblings of a Madam Dragonfly and some more Royal City, possibly Static Age, all upcoming.

00:41:26.949 --> 00:41:28.302
Is that, is that accurate?

00:41:28.302 --> 00:41:34.302
So yeah, mean, whenever you see what's coming out, it's not really always an accurate sort of workload.

00:41:34.302 --> 00:41:38.481
know, mean, Robin and Batman too, or yeah, the Robin and Batman story.

00:41:38.681 --> 00:41:41.561
That was three issues and I wrote all those like two years ago.

00:41:41.561 --> 00:41:45.742
know, mean, it just takes us in a while to paint them.

00:41:45.742 --> 00:41:47.362
And yeah, what else are we talking?

00:41:47.362 --> 00:41:52.262
Some of that stuff is stuff like Black Hammer was written a year ago or a year and a half ago, you know.

00:41:52.402 --> 00:41:53.722
And so it's not always accurate.

00:41:53.722 --> 00:41:56.621
But then, of course, there's other projects that haven't been announced yet.

00:41:56.621 --> 00:41:57.557
So I don't know.

00:41:57.557 --> 00:41:58.458
Yeah, it is.

00:41:58.458 --> 00:41:59.940
I'm always juggling a lot of stuff.

00:41:59.940 --> 00:42:04.405
I'm trying to cut down when I, every time I say that I end up taking something else.

00:42:05.094 --> 00:42:13.934
You sound like me over here on the podcast and I'm not trying to compare the two, like Aaron and I, have a lot of, Aaron's my cohost here on the Oblivion Bar and we've been doing it for five years.

00:42:13.934 --> 00:42:15.273
We absolutely love it.

00:42:15.273 --> 00:42:20.153
You know, talking to creators and talking about movies and television series and, and anime and all the things.

00:42:20.153 --> 00:42:23.554
These interviews, they are the biggest workload that we have here on the show.

00:42:23.554 --> 00:42:32.418
And every time we have a little bit of a reprieve or if we've done three or four of these in a row, I always tell Aaron, I'm like, man, we need to take a little bit of a break from the interviews and just.

00:42:32.418 --> 00:42:36.541
you know, do a movie review or do a comic spotlight or something else.

00:42:36.541 --> 00:42:41.012
But I love this so much, being able to talk to someone like you or other creators.

00:42:41.012 --> 00:42:43.514
It's honestly the lifeblood of this show.

00:42:43.514 --> 00:42:49.099
And I totally get, you you get excited about something or you have a project that you really want to work on.

00:42:49.099 --> 00:42:51.478
I get not being able to say no to something like that.

00:42:51.478 --> 00:42:54.320
Yeah, or to collaborate with someone you really want to work with.

00:42:54.320 --> 00:42:55.342
It's hard to see no one.

00:42:55.342 --> 00:42:56.753
But yeah, yeah, we'll see.

00:42:56.753 --> 00:42:58.244
I am trying to cut down.

00:42:58.510 --> 00:43:01.992
Is there anything that I'm missing from that list by the way, like of all the things that I just listed off?

00:43:01.992 --> 00:43:04.971
there anything that's been announced that like.

00:43:05.514 --> 00:43:07.014
There's nothing that's been announced.

00:43:07.014 --> 00:43:18.327
There's some other stuff I'm working on now that will probably be announced, I don't know, later this year or next year, but no, I think you got all of it.

00:43:18.327 --> 00:43:21.081
Can I press you a little bit on something that I've heard rumblings of?

00:43:21.081 --> 00:43:21.844
Sure.

00:43:21.844 --> 00:43:23.135
You don't have to divulge anything.

00:43:23.135 --> 00:43:28.414
Obviously, I don't think you would anyway, but there's been talks of a secret dream project over at D.C.

00:43:28.414 --> 00:43:30.516
with Rafael de Lerete.

00:43:30.516 --> 00:43:33.777
uh Is there anything you can say about this at all or?

00:43:33.777 --> 00:43:42.472
It's, it's, it's kind of semi embarrassing because my dream DC project is like the DC character no one asked for.

00:43:43.085 --> 00:43:44.405
We'll see you later.

00:43:44.983 --> 00:43:46.164
But yeah, I working on that.

00:43:46.164 --> 00:43:53.634
It's like this weird childhood itch I needed to scratch for this certain character that again, no one's banging down the doors asking for.

00:43:53.634 --> 00:43:59.670
Sometimes those are good ones because you have so much freedom to kind of put yourself into them, you know.

00:43:59.670 --> 00:44:02.853
um It's been really fun writing it actually.

00:44:03.327 --> 00:44:09.054
Is it I know you like to play sort of in the darker corner of DC am I getting warm?

00:44:09.677 --> 00:44:13.137
Oh yeah, it's not, I don't think you would ever guess who it is.

00:44:13.637 --> 00:44:15.318
It's very random.

00:44:15.338 --> 00:44:27.617
And it's this six issue mini where we completely, we had a lot of freedom to sort of, because no one was asking for this character to sort of really push the limits of what the character is and we'll be moving forward.

00:44:27.617 --> 00:44:28.918
So that's always fun.

00:44:28.918 --> 00:44:29.478
Yeah.

00:44:29.646 --> 00:44:32.481
Will we hear anything about this at like San Diego or is this going to be something much more.

00:44:32.481 --> 00:44:35.871
think it's maybe more of a New York click fall.

00:44:36.269 --> 00:44:36.681
Gotcha.

00:44:36.681 --> 00:44:37.213
Okay.

00:44:37.213 --> 00:44:40.487
And actually the first time and only time we've ever met was at New York.

00:44:40.487 --> 00:44:42.476
Are you going to go to New York again later this year as well?

00:44:42.476 --> 00:44:46.652
I don't think I'll be there, yeah, think they'll probably be announcing some new stuff.

00:44:46.891 --> 00:44:48.023
Okay, awesome.

00:44:48.023 --> 00:44:56.056
Well, you know, as we close this conversation, Jeff, because I feel like if I keep you here any longer, I'm going to keep trying to press you for this secret DC project and I want to just leave it as is.

00:44:56.056 --> 00:45:03.791
So, ah you know, as we close here, I want to take a little snippet from 10,000 Inkstains and sort of put a stamp on this conversation.

00:45:03.791 --> 00:45:07.554
you say, Jack Kirby famously said, comics will break your heart kid.

00:45:07.554 --> 00:45:11.496
And maybe he was right, but I also know comics can put it back together again, too.

00:45:11.496 --> 00:45:14.177
And I wouldn't dare to argue with the king.

00:45:14.177 --> 00:45:28.157
But I tend to agree with you too, Jeff, because I feel like you are walking, talking embodiment of that sentiment that, know, for all the woes that we have in our lives, comics for a lot of us is sort of that backbone of happiness, whether it be collecting or reading.

00:45:28.157 --> 00:45:29.797
And I just really love that sentiment.

00:45:29.797 --> 00:45:32.489
I think that that's a perfect way to sort of end this conversation.

00:45:32.489 --> 00:45:35.090
I think that's a perfect way to end 10,000 ink stains.

00:45:35.090 --> 00:45:40.134
And I cannot implore people enough to go get 10,000 ink stains when it hits shelves on July 15th.

00:45:40.222 --> 00:45:40.742
thanks, Chris.

00:45:40.742 --> 00:45:42.041
I appreciate that.

00:45:42.521 --> 00:45:43.101
Absolutely.

00:45:43.101 --> 00:45:47.125
uh And again, I think everyone should call their local comic book shop and pre-order that.

00:45:47.125 --> 00:45:55.862
And Jeff, I couldn't get to the majority of the projects that you're working on as we talked about, know, Absolute Flash, uh Black Hammer.

00:45:55.862 --> 00:46:11.327
We can't even talk about the terrific here today, but you know, I would love to at some point down the road, if you have the availability to come back here on the Oblivion Bar and talk about some of those other projects, whether it just be a centralized conversation about one of those or just sort of, you know, noodle on a couple of different ones.

00:46:11.391 --> 00:46:11.902
Sounds good.

00:46:11.902 --> 00:46:16.010
How about when that new DC book is announced, we'll come on and talk.

00:46:16.119 --> 00:46:16.661
I would love that.

00:46:16.661 --> 00:46:19.755
Maybe we can get Rafael in here as well and maybe get him to talk about it.

00:46:19.755 --> 00:46:20.735
Yeah, that'd be great.

00:46:20.735 --> 00:46:28.445
Well, before I let you go, is there anything that you want to sort of plug or highlight, you know, tales from the farm or anything else that you want to sort of discuss before we let you go?

00:46:28.706 --> 00:46:29.306
I it's cool.

00:46:29.306 --> 00:46:31.686
think, yeah, I'm excited for 10,000 in Staines.

00:46:31.686 --> 00:46:36.099
know, it's obviously in some ways the most personal thing I've ever put out into the world.

00:46:36.099 --> 00:46:45.923
So it's a big, kind of feels like a big risk for me or big, but it's also nice to share some more of myself with my readers and connect with them.

00:46:45.923 --> 00:46:47.253
So yeah, I'm excited.

00:46:47.489 --> 00:46:49.411
Yeah, I'm very excited to see how people react to this.

00:46:49.411 --> 00:46:55.463
again, the couple of folks that I have talked to about it that are big fans of yours are very excited for it as well.

00:46:55.463 --> 00:47:01.114
And I will tell you as someone who's read most of it now, it's exactly what you want from being a longtime fan of yours.

00:47:01.114 --> 00:47:03.498
So Jeff, again, thank you so much for being here.

00:47:03.498 --> 00:47:04.440
I really appreciate it.

00:47:04.440 --> 00:47:06.420
Excited to get you back on the show at some point.

00:47:06.420 --> 00:47:08.192
Excited to see you here in a couple of weeks in San Diego.

00:47:08.192 --> 00:47:08.942
That's going be really fun.

00:47:08.942 --> 00:47:12.583
And hopefully you remember this face and we can about.

00:47:14.125 --> 00:47:16.215
Yeah, that's other thing is we didn't get to talk about.

00:47:16.215 --> 00:47:17.976
the or I, and you know what?

00:47:17.976 --> 00:47:18.650
I feel bad.

00:47:18.650 --> 00:47:19.851
feel like a bad Jeff Lemire fan.

00:47:19.851 --> 00:47:23.317
Now who are you a fan of the Leafs?

00:47:23.317 --> 00:47:23.586
Okay.

00:47:23.586 --> 00:47:24.137
That makes sense.

00:47:24.137 --> 00:47:29.356
I wanted to say that, but I wasn't, I didn't want to assume so, and there's no rivalry between the blues and the Leafs, right?

00:47:29.356 --> 00:47:31.509
Okay.

00:47:31.509 --> 00:47:33.454
I, stand by this today.

00:47:34.414 --> 00:47:35.514
We should start one.

00:47:35.514 --> 00:47:35.965
We should start.

00:47:35.965 --> 00:47:39.126
online beef for the Maple Leaves and the Blues.

00:47:39.306 --> 00:47:43.726
Although I will say the Blues, even though we made the playoffs, weren't great this year.

00:47:45.905 --> 00:47:48.686
I will say, and I'll end on this, stop.

00:47:48.686 --> 00:47:50.525
I'll leave it alone after this.

00:47:50.525 --> 00:47:55.465
To date, the greatest sporting event I've ever witnessed in my life was being in St.

00:47:55.465 --> 00:48:05.666
Louis and witnessing that 2019 team win the Stanley see these fans that have been Blues fans since like the late 60s.

00:48:05.666 --> 00:48:06.934
finally singing.

00:48:06.934 --> 00:48:09.655
the blues take home the cup, there's nothing like it.

00:48:09.655 --> 00:48:10.610
Yeah, that's amazing.

00:48:10.610 --> 00:48:13.380
I hope to one day witness such a thing here.

00:48:14.327 --> 00:48:16.103
That was not me trying to rub it in your face.

00:48:16.103 --> 00:48:18.893
promise All right, Jeff.

00:48:18.893 --> 00:48:19.614
Well, I appreciate you man.

00:48:19.614 --> 00:48:21.289
Thank you so much and we'll talk soon.

00:48:21.409 --> 00:48:22.753
All right, thanks, Chris.

00:48:23.489 --> 00:48:25.760
Alrighty, there's that conversation with Jeff Lemire.

00:48:25.760 --> 00:48:28.282
Once again, thank you so much to Jeff for coming on the show.

00:48:28.282 --> 00:48:33.483
Really, really appreciate you coming here, taking some time to talk about your career and 10,000 ink stains.

00:48:33.483 --> 00:48:39.556
And I hope that this conversation, if you are a giant Jeff Lemire fan like I am, I'm sure you're already excited for this.

00:48:39.556 --> 00:48:49.501
But if you were on the fence or if you had never really heard Jeff talk about his career or maybe you've never read any of his works, hopefully this entices you to go at least check out some of bigger work.

00:48:49.501 --> 00:48:52.224
Like again, Sweet Tooth is a big one that people like to.

00:48:52.224 --> 00:49:05.929
Recommend Gideon Falls is another big one a lot of his big two stuff again as we talked about there just a moment ago Didn't really even talk much about his big two stuff, which I mean you could make an argument that a lot of his work is Sort of with within Marvel and DC.

00:49:05.929 --> 00:49:09.851
So make sure you guys go check that out Definitely recommend his moon night run really like that one.

00:49:09.851 --> 00:49:26.626
I think that's a really interesting take and Century another good one gosh I mean, there's there's just so many that we could we could go to but uh I found it really interesting something I wanted to sort of noon along for a moment was that In the conversation, Jeff talks about how after he finishes any of his projects, he doesn't often go back to them.

00:49:26.626 --> 00:49:34.226
You know, he just sort of moves on to the next thing and he's obviously working on so many things all the time, which I didn't really get to get into in this conversation.

00:49:34.226 --> 00:49:38.246
And I'm kind of bummed about it I would love to learn how he was able to sort of juggle all of that.

00:49:38.246 --> 00:49:45.226
And I know it's not all timed out and he's not like working all of it all at the same time, but it is still a lot, I think, to sort of do as much as he does.

00:49:45.226 --> 00:49:50.806
You know, there's some creators that only work on maybe one, sometimes two projects at once and then they move on to next thing.

00:49:50.806 --> 00:49:55.701
Again, I found it really interesting that he said that he hasn't really gone back until putting together 10,000 ink stains.

00:49:55.701 --> 00:49:58.523
And I think that this is a really cool retrospective.

00:49:58.523 --> 00:50:14.467
And I kind of really wish that more creators would do something like this, like 10,000 ink stains, where you can reflect on your career and then sort of learn from things that you maybe did incorrectly, or maybe some things you're embarrassed about, some things that you maybe did purposely incorrectly, or maybe you arrogant about, I don't know.

00:50:14.467 --> 00:50:15.777
There's a lot to learn from our mistakes.

00:50:15.777 --> 00:50:18.110
And I think that Jeff is very aware of that.

00:50:18.190 --> 00:50:20.570
And I love that he did this with 10,000 ink stains.

00:50:20.570 --> 00:50:30.289
And I do also love that he worked in a restaurant, which, you again, long time listeners of the Oblivion Bar know that I sort of, again, revere my time as a bartender and miss it all the time.

00:50:30.289 --> 00:50:39.670
But as Jeff says in this conversation, you kind of have to get away because it will, you know, that lifestyle will suck you up into it and you will burn the candle at both ends pretty quickly.

00:50:40.050 --> 00:50:41.590
again, thank you, Jeff.

00:50:41.590 --> 00:50:42.329
Thank you everybody listening.

00:50:42.329 --> 00:50:46.349
And also thank you again, Dark Horse for helping us set up this conversation with Jeff and.

00:50:46.349 --> 00:50:49.269
to give me early access to this memoir from Jeff.

00:50:49.409 --> 00:50:53.210
that'll do it for episode 197, 198 everybody.

00:50:53.210 --> 00:50:54.670
We're getting into July.

00:50:55.090 --> 00:50:59.289
So San Diego Comic-Con is right around the corner, which is very exciting because both Aaron and I will be there.

00:50:59.289 --> 00:51:02.030
So if you're at San Diego Comic-Con, please come say hello.

00:51:02.030 --> 00:51:03.809
That would be awesome.

00:51:04.010 --> 00:51:13.449
also if you've heard of them, these two small indie films that are coming out in July, you've got Fantastic Four, First Steps, and then Superman over at DC Studios.

00:51:13.590 --> 00:51:14.230
So.

00:51:14.230 --> 00:51:23.213
a lot to discuss with those two, but also again, as I just mentioned there, San Diego third week of July will definitely be there and it'll be insane.

00:51:23.213 --> 00:51:26.054
So I'm sure we got to do something interesting and fun for that.

00:51:26.054 --> 00:51:40.297
But also I think, I mean, you can make an argument as the biggest thing in July is we're recording our 200th episode, our 200th episode here on the Abilion Bar podcast, which is a huge milestone and something that Aaron and I have been very loosely discussing what we want to do.

00:51:40.297 --> 00:51:51.206
But I think In reality, what it might end up becoming is us just sort of talking about the last 200 episodes and sort of in a very 10,000 ink stains way, a retrospective on the oblivion bar over the last five years.

00:51:51.206 --> 00:52:00.530
And it's crazy to think that we've done this silly show for five years and it's given us the opportunity to go to Comic-Con every year and to talk to creators like Jeff Lemire.

00:52:00.771 --> 00:52:08.717
It's been an incredible ride and you know, next week, regardless of what we're talking about, which again, we'll probably end up being Superman, if I'm being honest.

00:52:08.717 --> 00:52:11.637
Aaron will be here and it's just been really exciting.

00:52:11.637 --> 00:52:17.318
We can't thank everyone that listens to show enough for continuing to follow us here on the Oblivion Bar.

00:52:17.318 --> 00:52:20.478
So that will do it for episode 197.

00:52:20.617 --> 00:52:30.318
If you want to subscribe to the podcast, you can follow us over on Spotify, YouTube, Audible, iHeartRadio, Apple Podcasts, wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts, that's where we are.

00:52:30.318 --> 00:52:36.405
Big shout out to our patrons, Alex, Alice, Aaron, Bodder, Chris S, Chris Y, Christie, David, Elliot, Erica.

00:52:36.405 --> 00:52:50.322
George Gianni, Greg, Haley, Ham Six, Jake, Jeremy, Kyle, Losey, Mac, Miles, Mike, Olivia, Ryan L, Robert, Saunter, Sebastian, Sean, Trevor, Travis, and Zach and Brad and Lisa over at the Comfortable Couples Counseling.

00:52:50.322 --> 00:52:52.802
Thank you all so much for joining us here on the Patreon.

00:52:52.802 --> 00:52:54.914
Again, patreon.com forward slash oblivion bar pod.

00:52:54.914 --> 00:53:02.086
If you want to support the show in a free way, go over to your preferred podcasting platform and give us a five star rating and or a written review.

00:53:02.086 --> 00:53:04.137
All of that helps us get into the algorithm.

00:53:04.166 --> 00:53:06.996
Only five star reviews, please, unless you hate the show, just don't rate it.

00:53:06.996 --> 00:53:10.237
But if you love what we do here, five stars would be incredible.

00:53:10.237 --> 00:53:14.949
Again, that's really the best way to get us into the algorithm, both on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

00:53:15.309 --> 00:53:19.471
Follow us over on Blue Sky, Instagram, TikTok and Twitch at Oblivion Bar Pod.

00:53:19.471 --> 00:53:23.652
Official merch for the show can be found over on our website, OblivionBarPodcast.com.

00:53:23.652 --> 00:53:28.833
Big, big thank you to Oni Press and Endless Comics Games and Cards for sponsoring the show.

00:53:29.090 --> 00:53:31.811
very much appreciate them continuing to follow us over here on the Oblivion Bar.

00:53:31.811 --> 00:53:34.853
Big thank you to KXD Studios for all of our Oblivion Bar art.

00:53:34.853 --> 00:53:37.394
He is at KXD Graphics on Instagram.

00:53:37.394 --> 00:53:39.536
Thank you DreamKid for all of our musical themes.

00:53:39.536 --> 00:53:42.117
Thank you DJ Skyvac for that grid theme.

00:53:42.117 --> 00:53:47.429
And once again, and uh please keep this in mind as things start to get crazy here in the U.S.

00:53:47.429 --> 00:53:51.282
over the summer, do not forget to your bartenders 20 % or more.

00:53:51.282 --> 00:53:52.902
20 % is the bare minimum.

00:53:52.902 --> 00:53:58.115
If you're listening from Canada over where Jeff is currently staying, I don't think they do tipping.

00:53:58.115 --> 00:53:58.989
I think they just...

00:53:58.989 --> 00:54:01.190
pay their service industry correctly.

00:54:01.590 --> 00:54:04.170
So, I mean, I guess if you want to tip 20, that'd be cool.

00:54:04.170 --> 00:54:08.989
But I've heard in some countries, it's sort of an insult to tip 20 % because they're tipped normally.

00:54:08.989 --> 00:54:10.650
They're like, what, you're not making, I'm not making enough money?

00:54:10.650 --> 00:54:11.869
You think I'm broke?

00:54:11.869 --> 00:54:13.110
Which would never be me.

00:54:13.110 --> 00:54:15.409
I could be making $100 an hour in a restaurant.

00:54:15.409 --> 00:54:17.849
I would still take that tip all day, every day.

00:54:17.849 --> 00:54:19.570
But point being here in the U.S.

00:54:19.570 --> 00:54:25.789
tip your bartenders, your servers, your valet, your Uber driver, whomever, tip on 20%.

00:54:25.789 --> 00:54:27.083
That's that's.

00:54:27.083 --> 00:54:28.956
It makes their day and it's easy on you.

00:54:28.956 --> 00:54:32.021
once again, thank you all so much for listening to the Oblivion Bar podcast.

00:54:32.021 --> 00:54:36.846
Next week, Aaron will be back, but until then, we will see you next week for episode one.

00:54:36.846 --> 00:54:38.646
1998.